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10-01-1973 - Regular Meeting - Minutes0 MINUTES OF ADJOURNED REGULAR MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL IN JOINT SESSION WITH HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION CITY OF WEST COVINA, CALIFORNIA OCTOBER 1, 1973. • The adjourned regular meeting of the City Council called to order at 7:30 P.M. in the West Covina. Council Chambers by Mayor Pro Tem Chester Shearer. The Pledge of Allegiance was led by Councilman Russ Nichols. ROLL CALL Present: CITY COUNCIL - Mayor Pro Tem Shearer;. Councilmen: Young, Nichols, Chappell Absent: Mayor Lloyd (In San Diego on City busi- ness) HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION Present: Chairman Maeda; Commissioners: Teall, Smith, Cano, Wallace Others Present: George. Aiassa, City Manager George Zimmerman, Public Service Director Lela Preston, City Clerk Jeff Butzlaff, Administrative Analyst, Jr. Ross Bonham, Administrative Analyst Mike McDonnell, Staff Reporter - S.G.V.D.T. Lyn Giles, Youth Advisory Commissioner .At 7:32 P.M. the chair adjourned the meeting in the Council Chambers due to lack of an audience and for the convenience of better communication reconvened the joint meeting of City Council and the Human Relations Commission in the City Manager's conference room. Meeting reconvened at 7:40 P.M. JOINT CITY COUNCIL - HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION SESSION is either too liberal or too change it. Mayor Pro tem'Shearer: The purpose of this meeting is to evaluate the role of the Human Relations Commission in light of the enabling resolution and determine if the resolution conservative, and if'Council so desires`to Chairman Maeda: 1 would like..to..take:.this:.opportuni.ty to thank.the:Council for the opportunity to meet with you and discuss the scope of the Human Relations Commissions' responsibilities and duties. We are here not to challenge anyone's remarks or comments of the past but simply seeking guidance and optimistically seeking better ways to foster understanding in our community. I would like to say that this subject, the scope of our authority, as covered by Mr. Wakefield in his letter, he did spell out our scope very well and I wholeheartedly agree with what he has stated. We had a meeting and we discussed what • shall we present to Council regarding our scope and this question of our scope of responsibility seems constantly to arise whenever legality is involved. As an example taking from the transcript of one.of our meetings "Meanwhile Fred Smith is to continue his investigation of the legal implications of this issue and, if necessary, will contact FEPC for specific direction." We would like from Council a more specific explanation of their thoughts on this. How far can we go in writing letters to an individual, a group, or the San Gabriel Valley Tribune? And should our letters first be approved by Council? - 1 - CITY COUNCIL and Page Two HUMAN RELATIONS COMM. MEETING 10/1/73 Mayor Pro Tem Shearer: Perhaps before we get into a specific discussion on the points in Mr. Wakefield' letter and the report submitted by Staff, it might be well to have the Council members state some of their more general concerns. Councilman Nichols, I believe, was instrumental in • drawing up the original resolution setting up the Human Relations Commission and he was the one that initially commented on some of these items, although it was not just his concern but all of our con- cerns. So Mr. Nichols, if you care to, why don't you expound in gen- eral on this subject. Councilman Nichols: I found over the years that one of the most difficult things to talk about is issues without involving personalities. We can come together in a setting, whether it be a PTA Executive Board or the School District Board, or State Highway Commission, or whatever and an individual begins to talk about an issue and immediately attributed to the remarks are personalities, the indivi- duals involved somehow are a part of it. Obviously, I have given a great deal of thought on what.I am about to say and I want it not attributed to any personalities involved. We have people here" serving on this Commission who are very dedicated and striving mightily to do a meritorious job, probably much harder than they would have to in the office of anyone of our other Commissions. But after having been one of the fathers of the Human Relations Commission, observing its mechanisms and functions and observing turnover and more personalities involved in this Commission than in any other, I have come to the conclusion that it should either be completely disbanded or its whole structure changed in terms of the enabling resolution that constructed it.. Members of the Commission trying to do a service for the community, and certainly they are, run constantly against . limiting aspects of the enabling resolution. I, at no time wanted to imply to the community or to the Council that I am opposed to the Human Relations Commission, but I am saying that this Commission is constantly running against the original resolution and that there have been times when in my judgment they have exceeded the authorization of that resolution, and think it is.time the Council. took a close"look at the resolution and reach a conclusion. One, either the original purposes have been fulfilled and/or the purposes no longer exist, in which case the Commission should be phased out; or perhaps do exist, which in this event the Commission should be given the latitude and authority to carry out their purposes. We felt originally there were purposes. I don't know that those purposes do exist now. I think they do exist but probably in a different framework. I do know the enabling resohtion, in my judgment, does not support the kinds of actions that the Commission has evidenced it would like to engage in. So at some point we are going to have to discuss what these aspects are. What the Commission can or can't do. What it should do or should not do. In careful analysis of the resolution I believe we have a toothless Commission, which in itself is largely frustrated in its actions, and the Council should either • increase its authorization to the extent that certain conflicing laws will allow or say finally - we have calmed down, we have integrated and thanks a lot but we are closing you down. That is the way I feel. Councilman Young: I do appreciate Councilman Nichols' laying his thoughts right out on the line, cold turkey. I am not sure I agree with all of those thoughts, I feel that there are many many areas in this City that'the Human Relations Commission can.be a con- tributing factor, either to help prevent the type of situatiLon to'. - 2 - riUMA.ti R L[:T_LUiV 5 COMM. MEETING 10/1/73 develop which we do not want in the City, or to try to, as it says in the resolution, pinpoint areas of tension. And as I recall a few years ago when this new apartment at California and Cameron came in, a lot of people were concerned about the impact this would have on the central city area because of its low cost attractiveness and felt it would attract low income people and hence crime, being the two things often linked statistically. I felt at that time rather than sit • around and worry and moan about what might happen that we should have an effective program in mind to keep those things from happening. I feel it is good human relations to do that. I am concerned if the Commission on its own motion or its°own authority goes outside the City, like to the FEPC for example, for direction. This type thing, or any other Agency that exists outside of the City, I think if the Commission feels that such an Agency should be involved the Commission should advise the City Council and state the reasons for this and these kinds of contacts should be made either by the City Council or on specific authority of the City Council. On the other hand I quite agree with Mr.,Wakefield's analysis, if the Commission feels that the Daily Tribune is continuing a practice which is unfriendly to good human relations, T am not offended by the Commission making a contact with the community paper, although it is a little broader than a community paper, it is regional but located in our City; so I am not offended by that. Mayor Pro Tem Shearer: Councilman Chappell? Councilman Chappell: Not right now. Thank you. Mayor Pro Tem Shearer: I would agree that in many situations the Commission is "toothless" as stated by Mr. Nichols. I think we should have • Commissions which will work not as a puppet on the string of the Council. We should have Commissioners that are conscientious in doing their.job and if it becomes necessary to make recommendations that perhaps some of us do not like to hear, that they should feel free to go right ahead and make such recommendations. I am not sure I would go so far as what Councilman Young has said, that anytime they wanted to consult with an outside organization they would have to get our authorization. I think it would depend on the purpose of that contact. If the purpose was to gain information to assist them in making a recommendation to. the Council as to the action that the City should take, then I think that is one thing. If the consultation is an end in itself to see what the Commission can do to take action independent of the Council then I think we have an entirely different story. I am not sure what the intent of the contact in this particular case was but I see nothing wrong with the Human Relations Commission, Planning Commission, Personnel board, or anyone of us on the Council in gathering informa- tion to help us do our job. The problem comes when it comes out in the newspaper that the Commission is consulting with the FEPC. Some people perhaps can read into that more than what is really there. I personally am not in favor of doing away with the Commission. I think in these times it is well to have a Commission, even if the Commission isn't as active as some might want them to'be. The fact they are there and ready and not after a situation arises mobilized • and brought together. I would like to see a Commission only as active as necessary, not over -active. These are sensitive areas. An over -active individual or group can sometimes generate situations that might not otherwise occur. I would like the Commission to be just as active as necessary depending on the time and situation. - 3 - CITY COUNCIL and Page Four HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION MEETING 10/1/73 U • • Okay, now we have all had our say on the Council, do any of the other Commissioners wish to comment? Commissioner Teall: I would like to make a statement, if I may. .Number 1 - I honestly do believe that purposes do exist for the main- taining of the Human Relations Commission in this City: I disagree, if I may, in regards to we should sit back and do nothing except when something happens. I think the whole purpose of this type of Commission is to do exactly as we were directed originally to do which is to initiate and encourage activities which tend to promote inter -racial activities within the City of West Covina and this is what we are trying to do this past year. As a group we have been trying to activate ourselves in the community, rightly or wrongly, to bring forth to the City of West Covina that this is a great place to live, both ethnically and racially. The City Attorney pretty much agrees that what we have been doing hasn't been wrong. The one statement that seems to bother the Council is the statement by Mr. Smith about going to the FEPC, and if I remember correctly, it was primarily to find out if we were right or wrong,in our,discussion in this area of the Tribune. Commissioner Smith: That is correct. Commissioner Teall: And not to formulate any action. We realize our direction is not as an action Commission. At a certain point we would come to you and say this is what we would recommend in a situation like this, but if we have to ask your permission to write a letter under certain circumstances then it would have to be spelled out more definitely in .the authority granted by Council, otherwise we could sit.back and say can we write so and so? We would like to know where can we or can't we? We think we are all here working together, this is not a battleground but a planning board, trying to make this a better City for all. I really think this group has worked together well, we disagree violently sometimes, we have great crowds down here sometimes one or two people show up, but we do agree in principles. No one is trying to take any authority. In fact I don't want it. Thank you. Commissioner Wallace: When Councilman Nichols was talking about either broadening the scope or dissolving the Commission something came to mind which I think may be the crux of the matter and that is its definition as'being purely racial and ethnic. I think the human relations problems that exist are not limited to race or ethnic groups. It could have to do with age. The older people or the youth. I could be geogrphic location in the community. I can't see it being sex, but I will throw that in since it seems to be timely. Perhaps it is our concept of what human relaions is that is the crux of the thing. Perhaps we could be of more assist- ance to the community if we weren't thought of as strictly something to call on if there is'a racial problem. Councilman Young: I think Commissioner Wallace makes a good point for consideration, particu- larly in reference to the geographic and age situations. We could consider the role of this Commission as a human relations Commission dedicated towards building a better community to live.in and work in and de-emphasize the racial/ethnic thing as a part of it, not necessarily a large part of it. - 4 - CITY COUNCIL and Page Five HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION MEETING 10/1/73 Mayor Pro tem Shearer: I would like to direct a question of the Commission. Maybe I misunderstood what Mrs. Wallace said. Is it your impression that the resolution limits you, or the general feeling of the people is that it is a racial/inter-racial group only? Because I don't • read in the four items I have here - the charges and purposes of the - Commission - I think A. and D would cover age; sex, and in A in the case of a legal violation, and there are laws, that say you cannot discriminate against sex or age in addition to race. B and C do refer to racial/ethnic activities and D is to keep the Council informed on all problems. So this then would not be limited to ethnic/racial problems. Commissioner Wallace: Perhaps the emphasis exists in people's minds only and not .in its legal defini- tion of the resolution. Commissioner Cano: In going over in my mind some of the meetings we have had in the past I think the description of a frustrated group of people hit it right on the nose. Part and parcel of the problem I believe is the scope and mandate of the resolution itself. I believe with Commissioner Wallace there are other aspects that I would certainly be interested in as a Human Relations Commissioner. And the only part that I would say that would sort of direct us to do that aspect of it would be the local inter -group relations, to keep Council informed on all problems of local inter -group relations. That mandate is in essence telling us only to keep you gentlemen informed, but not really take any action. The action is in A, B, and C, and I would read A, B, and C to be.mainly with ethnic problems. I see the problems • not only to be with the aged, I see the problems of mental health, of alcoholism, of drugs, the whole gamut of human problems. I would voice my preference, and as Councilman Nichols says either let's redo the resolution to include these things or in essence take the position of doing away with the. Human Relations Commission because in fact we cannot deal with the organism in total then what we are doing is frustrating each other in our efforts in any one direction. Chairman Maeda: I would like to go through A, B, C, and D. In reading the scope of authority I would say it would cover practically everything on human relations. I think the question arises as to how shall we implement the actions we have actually discussed at our meetings - how far can we go - what can we write - what kind of correspondence can we carry on? I think anything outside of our meeting, well what I get from this meeting, anything outside of our meeting should be approved by the Council. Is that correct? Because I think A, B and C does cover most every phase of human. relations. Councilman Young: The problem I think is as stated better, by Councilman Nichols than I can state it - when the Commission becomes an active Commission doing things in the community, you are contacting the • FEPC for positive direction and that word "direction" is what throws everybody. If you are seeking FEPC for information as a resource group then I doubt that would be too disturbing but "direction" we feel should come from the Council based on information given to us including any information garnered from any government organization or any other organization that would be pertinent. But when you become activists,you are functioning as an official arm of the City of West Covina and this is where we can run into problems if we aren't fully coordinated because the Council is the policy making body of the City and any action that is taken that is policy in action. That is 5 - CITY COUNCIL and HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION MEETING Page Six 10/1/73 • n �J where we need to find out where we stand, to really properly communi- cate. Commissioner Cano: The question I would have, is there anyone here, at least in our group, that doesn't understand that to be so? In essence whatever action needs to be taken and we are talking about actions..... Commissioner Wallace: You are talking about legal actions? Commissioner Cano: No, not only legal action because there could be a variety of actions outside of the City, I am talking of official actions taken by the Commission outside of the City; I am not talking about gathering information but determining a position and then going forth with that position outside of the City. I always understood that the Council would take that action if action were necessary. I would like to ask that question of the Commissioners - is there anyone that doesn't understand that to be so? Commissioner Teall: I don't know of any action we have taken that would even include such a thing. Commissioner Cano: Meanwhile Fred Smith is to continue his legal implications with the FEPC, getting back to this specific case? I think most of the problems we have evolved to really have been from a misunderstanding of reading into something that isn't there. For instance that action of Fred Smith going to FEPC, I remember specifically he was going for information. And,secondly, the action we were hoping to take on the sidewalk was not to involve ourselves in the engineering field but only to deal with a human problem, because the kids were walking on peoples' lawns and out in the middle. of the street and the principal came to us and said these kids are going to get killed or hit in the head by some irate homeowner or bit by a dog. We need a sidewalk. So as such we approached it as a human problem with the recommendation that we would go whomever. That part I really don't remember, if it was to go to the Council or just gather information from the Engineering Department and then take to the Council for action or just what we were going to do, but I know it was strictly a human,peoples' problem. Commissioner Teall: It was a sounding board, in fact. The _way we read it these children were having trouble and as a human Relations Commission we supported the whole concept of sidewalks. We weren't saying do it or anything else. Councilman Young: I was at that meeting and it was an afterthought actually. The principal wasn't there to discuss sidewalks at all but he happened to have an audience and it popped into his mind. Commissioner Wallace: Probably because I had called him that day about the street problem, as a private citizen. Commissioner Teall: The one area that might not fit into this but I would like a reaction to is that of working with the Senior Citizens. We are actually not doing very much but only acting as a sounding board for the Senior Citizens that come to us with their feelings and complaints and we suggest where they can write to get answers to their - 6 - CITY COUNCIL and Page Seven HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION MEETING 10/l/73 problems, such as the dial -a- program and Mr. Cano got the information for them. I don't see anything in here that would direct us in this area other than we are furthering mutual understanding and • respect among all racial/ethnic groups - if you want to dig into that one sentence. But it might be in opposition to what you gentlemen are thinking you want of the Human Relations Commission because literally it doesn't fit into the definition of the scope of authority of the Commission. Commissioner Cano: I got a call at my office, an irate lady asking the Department of Health and Welfare to investigate the West Covina Health Department because they had literally told her to go to hell, using her own words. I couldn't understand it or believe it. We took some action and found out that some of the people down here had not been, according to her, courteous, so we went to the County and it was ironed out, but there are other human problems that we can deal with that in essence I think will give the City of West Covina more visibility as a human relations oriented City. Councilman Chappell: Perhaps in some of these areas, take the sidewalk episode for instance, perhaps a recommendation should have come right from you, a letter from the Chairman to the Mayor saying we have discovered something happening here, we have a sidewalk pro- blem, something like that, can you help us? In other words dialogue back and forth between the Council and the Commission. Maybe that is where we are falling down. Also the same thing with the health problems. You know the City has no health department but • we go through the City Manager's office, we tell him when we have a problem - will you contact the County? This you could do through the Council and this would be an affirmative action type program. Maybe that is the one step we are not taking. We read it only in the minutes. We do have a Council liaison attending sometimes but maybe that is our problem. We really aren't going to do too much in just reading your minutes. We wait until we hear from you and it says here in the resolution - keep the Council informed. Commissioner Teall: I think this is a very good point. I think we are all under the impression of "being informed" is through the minutes, but I can see where if we become a talkative group for a couple of hours you are busy like everyone else and you are not going to sit down and read two hours of minutes, so specific informa- tion should be directed to the Mayor and Council by letter. I think this is a point well taken. Commissioner.Cano: Using the format that we use - the problem, the solution or alternatives, and then let Council make the final decision. Councilman Chappell: As far as eliminating the Commission, I don't see that. This is like an ice- berg, you are sitting on top and something could happen at anytime in our community. We have seen it all around us, and having a group that is sitting there able to start reacting to problems immediately, because you can be called within a matter of 24 hours notice, so I think there is a purpose for your being there and maybe as Mr. Nichols said an enlargement of your goals and rewording the resolution so the average person could pick it up and know that you are involved in more than just racial problems, because for many years I thought that was all you were involved in. . - 7 - CITY COUNCIL and Page Eight HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION MEETING 10/1/73 Councilman Nichols: Well then if it were satisfying to each and every member of the Commission as well as the Council to believe that all of the concerns can be improved through better communication we can • readily solve all of these concerns by hereby saying we pledge to talk more or listen more - - but I don't defer to that, as valid as it is. That the problem that exists is just one of more communica- tion. I think it is a functional basic built in problem that the original resolution that established this Commission was for a time and era and the time is now not then and the conditions are different and if you try and patch it together and keep going under a ten year old resolution it is neither going to meet the times of today or . be satisfying to this Council, or the situations. This existed when there were no blacks in our community, there were a handful of black people in the community and agitation was beginning.and realtors were getting uptight and people were starting to talk and a few of the original concerned white people of the community came to the Council and said - look West Covina should take a lead in these matters. So the establishment of this Commission was a racial factor, it was nothing else and every word that went into the resolution that is here today had a basic racial connotation. It didn't have at that time concerns for what can we do for the old folks or West Covina, or how the kids get to their school, and who is walking down the street, etc. It was a racial situation in West Covina then and we began looking into it. At that time on the Council there were two advocates for the stablishment and two strong negative viewpoints - we don't need a Commission; and here was old lonesome Councilman Nichols in the middle trying to bargain and buy and get something together that everybody could live with. So basically yours truly drafted this resolution and it was a compromise. A compromise that recognized, • one - that the authorities told us the State and Federal Government had pre-empted enforcement and investigative aspects of the racial problems. That we could talk in West Covina and counsel and illuminate but that we could not investigate from an enforcement standpoint. And all of you that have had extensive experience in these areas recognize the doctrine of pre-emption. So finally this resolution came to pass at that time and we began moving in this area to the extent the resolution enabled us to do. Today these crises have largely passed, truly they have, because West Covina has been the leader in attempting to indicate that human beings are human beings in all things. Now some people can indite that I suppose, but at least as far as the government of West Covina is concerned West Covina has led the way and human relations do extend beyond this. There are blacks now fighting with blacks on the same blocks .that whites are fighting with whites and there are kids fighting with kids, and people arguing about this and that, that far transcend that earlier concern that we had regarding a racial problem only. What I am saying is if the Commission is to go further into the racial elements, fair employment practices, etc., the Council is going to have to give more authority because you step any further and you are transcending the resolution and possibly the law as well. If you want to go into other areas • where there are indeed considerable needs in our community, the resolution is rather nebulous, but more than that the community assumes you are a racial Board. Probably somebody is being discriminated against and can't buy a house! So if the Council says well we want you around as a body for the Council I think then the Council should take some action, some position that would delineate your role to bring it up to 1973, that says the things you are to do in 1973. If we do less and leave it as it is and you go right along some people will say - well they weren't set up to do that and they don't have the authority to do that. - 8 - CITY COUNCIL and Page Nine HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION MEETING 10/1/73 I think it is an area of delicacy. I think if someone comes to you and says we want to change your role to audting the relationship between the Sons of Italy and the West Covina Garden Club, you may feel offended that we are trying to take • the meat away from your job but I think nonetheless a realistic view has to be made and if you are going to continue on into the next decade as a forum representing the City of'West Covina there has to be a careful look at your role and the Councils' charge. Perhaps it would be best done through a Committee of.Councilmen and members of this Board sitting down and discussing the needs, the law, etc. If we are going to go out and go on with the original resolution we will only have frustration and misunderstanding over the years, so I think we should either retire you or renew your role and charges. Commissioner Smith: I agree with what has been said by quite a few people tonight. Looking at the scope of the Human. Relations Commission I see it as a very broad one. I am not an attorney but I am basing this on the fact we have had the house attorney expound on A, B, C and D on numerous occasions and I recall the one time he made the statement that it is a very broad resolution. First off I would like to say I think as a Commissioner I would like to see the Commission have the same respect as any other Commission in the City. By that I mean we are looked upon as being a Commission - some of us being professionals in the area of human relations because our daily livilihood is in that area - and as a result of that we are aware of State and Federal laws relative to discrimina- tion in all fields. • I would like to see the Human Relations Commission be one that not only people bring complaints to but one that other Commissions and people in the City might come to to obtain some advice or information on how something should be approached in this field. I think what the Commission has attempted to do and perhaps it has walked the thin line from time to time, but I think the Commission has tried to.do what has been implied here and that is "to initiate and encourage inter -racial activities". Getting back to the .Affirmative Action problem which has not been discussed too much tonight, I think what the Commission was trying to do, the Commission being charged with watching what is happening in the area of discrimination and since we are a Human Relations Commission we more than anyone else in the City are aware.of what is going on and of the new laws, and as a Commission we would be falling down on•our duties if we didn't bring certain things,to the attention of the City and we have been attempting to do that. Councilman Nichols: May I interject at this point? Now here is an area where I have a concern, and where there is definite disagree- ment. I don't believe that the Human Relations Commission has any constituted role whatsoever in dealing with the employment practices of the City of West Covina. Zero. Not only as I envision the resolution but as I see the law existing. I don't believe that you • have any authority to deal whatsoever with any employment matter in the City and I base that judgment on the fact that we have also established by ordinance a Personnel Board in the City that deals with the City's employment practices; Secondly, if there is any failure in the practicing or the upholding of the legal intent, that failure is a failure of the City Council of West Covina and if members of the Personnel Board individually or collectively get an input or a feeling that there are discriminatory practices operating in the internal employment practices of the City it is not a matter of the Human Relations Commission to deal with other than you can immediately call that to the attention of the City Council, because we are the City of West Covina. The City Council is elected by the - 9 - CITY COUNCIL and HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION MEETING Page Ten 10/1/73 people and is the City of West Covina. Therefore, without a charge from the Council if you attempt to begin dealing in employment practices and personnel relations of the City you are in fact deal- ing with the Councils' prerogatives. That does not say that you as a Commission should not immediately give to us any input you might • receive from those in the community.that feel things are not right, but I am talking about becoming the investigative body in terms of .the City's employment. practices,that devolves only upon the City Council. We are elected by the people to operate the internal family. We charge the Commission in its role with operating in the community. Now perhaps other Councilmen do not agree with my interpretation, but if they do not then this is one area I want clarified because I feel this has been destructive of the role of the Personnel Board right now which feels demeaned and diminished because it is not called upon to play these kind of roles. I realize I am shooting with both barrels all cocked, all loaded and all firing, and that is exactly the only way we would come out of this meeting with anything worth- while. Commissioner Smith: I would like to continue. I think there is a breakdown in communications to a degree. We sometimes read into a statement or we don't exactly hear what a person is trying to say and I think that is what brought this about just a moment ago. The Human Relations Commission I don't think has intended to involve itself in personnel problems. We have only tried to do what we are charged to do and that is if we see a problem to point it out to those bodies that handle that problem. Now if you say we see a problem and have not communicated that problem, well then I think we really do need to sit down and discuss what the Human Relations Commission can and can't do. Now what brought about the Affirmative Action problem, in the beginning the NAACP has been watching certain employment practices not only in the City but other companies within the City, they approached us informally about maybe trying to bring to the attention of the City affirmative action, and certain people had noticed certain laws being violated by the City, inadvertently; such as the proper signs not being displayed as per Federal.and State laws. With this information brought to us as a Commission we attempted to pass this information on to the proper people in West Covina. We did.not push because it is not in our charge'to push. We just brought it to the attention. We realize in the area of human relations if the element of fear was not in the heart of man we would not have the racial problems that we have in the world today. If the element of fear were not there people would under- stand better, there would not be a misunderstanding of semantics. You would not have to be careful of whether you used the word "direction" or "consultation". FEPC, a part of the State Government. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) is a Federal Agency and these two terms if you were to approach nine out of ten people in the country today, black or white, they look upon those organizations • as organizations in the business of enforcement of laws. As a result of that people are sensitive to talking to these agencies, but what people don't know is that these two agencies concilliate and give out information, they are there to serve as the Police Department does - call and get information. When the Commission suggested we were going to contact FEPC we were not going to contact them to find out how to circumvent the City or bring a charge against anyone. in the City but to obtain information: These two agencies, 90% of their - 10 - CITY COUNCIL and HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION MEETING Page Eleven 10/1/73 work is to give information on the phone to people or coming out and talking to people and clarifying things, because many of the laws on the books today are quite complex and contradictory. The State is not in agreement with the Federal Government and as a result employers • and others are caught in themiddle many times. I feel as a Commission before we could properly advise the Council of certain elements that we should go to the Agency that has the charge of enforcing and find out what their position is, what are they reacting to? So when we approached you we could say this is the problem as we see it and this is what we feel has -to be done according to the interpretation of the FEPC - that is all the Commission has tried to do.. I think there is a definite need for the Commission. Many of the problems that the Commission has solved you have not seen in the minutes. I think we do need to sit down and studythe.scope of the Commission and in some instances make it a little more liberal in that there have been times in the past where there have been problems brought to the attention of the Commission, not at a Commission meeting but maybe a phone call in the middle of the night and we have responded to it. I think, even though not stated so here in our charge, we as a Commission if someone calls and is distressed I think I would be remiss if I were to tell that person - and I have had persons call me as late as midnight in tears over some leaflet they found on their door and I have responded to it. I think we would be remiss if we said we can't talk to you now we had our meeting last night and it is just too bad you didn't get that notice last night and we can't help you. But we have responded as a Commission and as a result of that we have kept down a potential problem at one of the . apartment houses in the area due to the fact that Commissioners were contacted and we went out and solved the problem in conciliation, not forceable conciliation, no newspapers were involved, and as a result the problems were solved. We have had several problems like that, we.have handled them and are quite proud of the fact because we feel as a Commission that the residents of the City should not have to go to the FEPC, or CORE or any of the other agencies, because we feel we as a Commission are here to help conciliate .and solve these problems. Hopefully we will be able to.continue to do so. Section A - "To study formal complaints of unlawful discrimination and prejudice in the comunity and to offer services of conciliation in connection therewith." I would like to see some discussion on that particular problem due to the facts I mentioned a few moments ago. We have worked out a few problems primarily by circumventing Section A because the person called with regard to a housing problem and we said give us a chance.to work it out before going further. If we had a charge so set up that through a staff liaison we could contact him apprising him of the problem and talking with at least three other Commissioners available, reach a consensus of opinion as to how it should be solved - I think we should be set up in such a way as other Commissions in the City because many times people can't wait 30 days to have a problem solved and if we can't give it to them they are going elsewhere to get it solved. People will say I went to the Human Relations Commission and they couldn't help me I had to go to NAACP, CORE, or whomever. • We hear this all the time, you are a do nothing Commission, you can't help us, and we have been attempting to destroy this image and to get the community involved in solving the problems we have here. Commissioner Cano: I think instead of dealing with generalities, in all due respect to Mr. Smith, I think we should get to the meat we are here for, and that is what are we going to agree on and what do we disagree on? I would like to deal with Councilman Nichols' recommendation that we discuss the personnel CITY COUNCIL and HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION MEETING Page Twelve 10/1/73 problem. I happen to agree that the personnel problem is within the scope of the Personnel Board. I would hate for the Planning Commission to start dealing in Human Relations, as I am sure the Personnel Board is having its own problems would hate for us to start dealing with • personnel problems that are by law mandated to. them. With that, why don't we start out by discussing - Number 1, the personnel issue and find out if we are, if we could and should get involved and to what degree? Commissioner Teall: I would like to state to my knowledge we have.not literally infringed on the Personnel Board. Some of it I -disagree with listening to Mr. Smith, many times I have disagreed. I got to the point one time where I really didn't know what I was talking about and the Council agreed that we should possibly get a representative from EEOC which we did. I think one or two of the members from Council were at that meeting and this young lady did a beautiful job of telling us exactly what the EEO C was and its function, and I was quite satisfied and educated and happy to leave it alone because I felt here we had communications at its best. We had members of Council who came to the meeting and this was the purpose of it and you took it back and this was your bag from then on. I don't think, Councilman Nichols, we really infringed as a Commission on the Personnel Board, or the Planning Commission or anyone else, and just to disagree slightly, I wish everyone would involve itself with the human relations aspect. Commissioner Cano: In essence that is what I am talking about, the action is really not .up to • us but to the City Council. Commissioner Teall: That is what I am saying - the action is not up to us but to the Council. But in regards to the.question of the Personnel Board, again I am sort of surprised because I had no idea we were even infringing in that area except for the fact we brought in a.member of the EEOC just so we could be better informed. Chairman Maeda: This may have come about because of the monthly meetings we had with the Mayor. At the first meeting I think each Commission discussed what our activities were and at that time I remember stating the Affirmative Action problem and what was being done. This may have been where it all came about. As a Commission at our meetings we did not discuss this problem in regard to action but only to find out more about it. Affirmative Action Program is nothing new, we have had it for about two years now and this is why I questioned it at that time as to what has been done. Commissioner Cano: So what is it we can do or can't do? Commissioner Smith: May I clarify one thing before going on? Reading the Council minutes I think there was a discussion. as to why the • Human Relations Commission was assigning a certain Commissioner to attend certain Commissions in the City, and I think this was brought about - I believe at one time we had Councilman Lloyd assigned.to us by Council and I think he suggested to us that he would like to see us assign a person to the various Commissions so we would have some communication and know what was going on, so when it was brought out that Fred Smith was going to the Personnel Board meetings he was going primarily to listen and come back and discuss with the Commissioners what he heard.. It was not to say we were going to do this or that, only as a listening board. r Commissioner Teall: That is right. I am assigned to the Youth Commission, when I can make it. 12 - CITY COUNCIL and Page Thirteen HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION MEETING 10/1/73 Not to try and influence them or anything else, but again to report back and develop better communications. • Mayor Pro tem Shearer: We could probably sit here all night and discuss, agree and disagree on various points, we need to take a particular direction because we have two alternates. Councilman Nichols started out with the suggestion of disbanding the Commission which I think from the consensus of what I have heard both on the part of the Commission and the Council is not a very good alternate. The second alternate is to perhaps review the existing resolution in light of the things that the Commission would like to do, to be able to do with a free conscience without fear of being zapped by the Council in public or private and not to accuse the tail wagging the dog, and I would suggest that the Commission do this; not in legal terms because we have an Attorney for that, but to list the various things in the' areas as a Commission that you would like to have the authority to do and present this to Council for either concurrence or disagreement. Those items that we concur on we will instruct the City Attorney to draft a new resolution to allow this expanded role, assuming it is an expanded role, and to eliminate these problems in the future that, we are now having. Otherwise I see no end to our deliberation and discussion this evening. You .people, as Mr. Smith indicated, several of you are experts in this field, perhaps you have a little more .feel of the real problems and needs in the area of human relations than the Council. So you tell us what you would like to be doing, want to do and the Council either agrees'or dis- agrees and we then instruct the City Attorney accordingly. Is there • anyone else that would like to elaborate on this? Commissioner Teall: I think it is an excellent idea and I would like to suggest that we have, if possible, one member of Council sit in when we are discussing this so we have a feeling of what we can do. I think we are all heading in the same direction but I think it would be very helpful. Councilman Young: It is a dangerous thing, Mr. Mayor, to have a Councilman sit in and partici- pate in a deliberation, because you have five Councilmen each with a different view and I think if you arrived at your collective points of view and presented it to the Council it would be a little bit better than the Nichols' Human Relations Commission or the Young Human Relations Commission or whatever. Mayor Pro tem Shearer: I would somewhat agree on that. I feel in this area I want the Commission to tell me what you want, separate and apart from any constraints from any of us. I might disagree but that should come in our discussion once you agree amongst yourselves. We want to hear your comments, not unduly influenced by the Council. Councilman Chappell: I think they have our feelings and we • all agree there should be some restructuring. You will not all agree with what you are going to put together and we will have .the right to look it over and strike out things and it certainly will not be a personal thing we do. I remember one time working with a group putting together something and when we started to strike out they got to feeling it was kind of a personal thing. If we were to change some portion of your recommendations it should not be taken personally. We have a political area that we also have to work in besides the practical area. Commissioner Cano: I would like to go on record with 13 - CITY COUNCIL and Page Fourteen HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION MEETING 10/1/73 suggesting some of the areas that I have always thought we should be dealing in: health, law enforcement, education, alcoholism, drugs, welfare, transportation and the environment. As far as I am concern- ed I see'some sort of a human problem dealing with all -eight of those • areas. Councilman Nichols: you do the greatest good? that your spectrum becomes in, yet if you become too in the community. You are and pick out those areas f There's where I see the essential pro" blem, everything is a human relations need. Where do you focus- where can If you leave yourselves open so broadly too big you can't do it, you have to hone narrow you lose thechance to be effective being given a very great challenge to try or 1973 that you can be most helpful in. Councilman Chappell: An area where you can achieve results and not be pounding your head against the wall. You talk about transportation - I have been sitting on Committees all year long and I am so'thoroughly confused today on the whole story and I have sat dozens of hours listening to experts on both sides with all kinds of degrees and they can't even agree, so we couldn't agree in areas like that as to the answer. But there are plenty of other areas. Commissioner Cano: The human rea would be for the transporta- tion of the youth and the aged. Commissioner Teall: As you said earlier - it isn't for the 70's it was for the 601s. With two • basic changes in B and C, by saying: To initiate and encourage activities which tend to promote harmony and progress in our community." Forget the inter -racial and inter - ethnic. And in C "To foster mutual understanding and respect among all groups." Councilman Nichols: Yet it is so refined that in two or three months the Council might be saying - now they have gone too far, and the Commission will be saying - do we really have the authority for doing it? Commissioner Teall: If you leave it as broad as it is but drop the racial and ethnic in B and C we can then be mandated by Council at any time saying we know there is a problem in such and such area and we wish you would look into it, or we can come to you and say we are looking at transportation, do you object to us forming a Committee to work in this area and you might say "no, that is'fine." I work for people and I work for you and if you tell me "no", you are still my boss, but this gives us the broadest range to do the things we might want to do without changing it every few years because something else comes up. Councilman Nichols: • recommendations to Council as ahead as a.Commission and then together as political animals. I can agree with what has been said and that perhaps you gentlemen should sit together and come up with your to how this Commission should move let us tear it apart and put it back Mayor Pro tem Shearer: I think an ideal resolution would be general without specifying the six or seven items and then we come up with an eighth one and it is an outdated resolution. It should be.two things. It should define as broadly as possible the areas in which you will operate and secondly, the depth you will operate. Spell out what your - 14 - CITY COUNCIL and Page Fifteen HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION MEETING 10/1/73 function is as well as the area. Beyond that I think the resolution could be very simply stated. (Councilmen agreed.) Councilman Young: I would like to say to Fred Smith - once • we eliminate fear from the face of the earth we will no longer need government of any kind. Commissioner Smith: I have one question. Maybe.I wasn't listening properly. If a problem comes before the Commission in the area of employment, say XYC Market down the street, or a person comes to us with a specific problem relative to West Covina that they are being discriminated against, in instance 1, do we deal with the XYC Market or we go through the Personnel Board?, Instance 2, the person who is alleging discrimination on the part of the City of West Covina, do we deal with that problem as a Human Relations Commission or we we say you have come before the wrong Commission? Councilman Nichols: The Personnel Board has nothing to do with the XYC Market, it has to do with the internal operations of the City. When you start talking about the hiring practices of the City or that some foreman down in the garage is discriminating in his recommenda- tion as a result of the exam you are talking about the internal hiring practices and in that instant I don't envision that you have any role whatsoever. If the XYC Market is involved in some activity you may have a role. Actually the State of California in court decisions has pre-empted the municipalities right to legislate or . find in areas of discrimination and employment in areas of the XYC Market, but we put into our resolution that you could conciliate and try and solve the problem on a cooperative basis. We also put in in order to prevent this sort of thing where a Commissioner comes to a meeting and says a friend of mine and I don't want to tell you who it is said that Mr. X said such about so and so and Mrs. Y said something else and they are having a terrible time down there on Michelle Street. I don't think we need today in our community a lot of loose talk about allegations against people unless the person offended is willing to stand up and say my name is Russ Nichols and that guy did this and I think he is,wrong and I would like to make a written complaint. Now if Mrs. Jones comes to you at a Commissioner and says I am willing to tell you this and to file an official complaint in writing then you may ask the Commission to conciliate the problem, but that is as far as your authority goes. As far as the guy that calls you at midnight, well bless your heart, anything you can do in human relations to get people together because you are known because you do carry a position of trust and to talk informally amongst your- selves to try and get people together and gatherings, etc., and perhaps get on the horn and call Chief Sill and say this is going on maybe you can do something about it - in a tactful humane way solve problems, well that is wonderful. We all do that every day. Some guy comes to me and says "can you fix this ticket". . that is a human relations problem and you have never had one of those! If you are talking about your function, your official role, it is to accept only those complaints that somebody stands behind, it is in writing and then you can only conciliate. That is what the resolution says and that's all. Commissioner Smith: If the applicant makes a specific charge against the City by alleging such and such? Councilman Nichols: Then you say that is not in our prevue and you should go to Council or the - 15 - CITY COUNCIL and Page Sixteen HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION MEETING 10/1/73 Personnel Board. At every Council meeting under Oral Communications we have people appear —this person can say -you five men hired the City Manager to run the'City you are responsible for everything he • does and everyone does and we think he and his subordinates are doing something wrong and we want to tell you something about it. We have a time in our meeting when citizens who are concerned or disgruntled about any thing can stand up and speak, because we are directly accountable for that. I don't think your elected City Council wants to delegate to any of its Commissions its responsibility for being accountable for the actions of its appointed officials. Because I think that would be a rather unusual type of delegation. So only .in that area where the City of West Covina is directly responsible then.I think Council should be responsible. Commissioner Cano: But in a case where somebody calls and says the City is discriminating because of this or.that and for us to say that is not within our prevue = I would imagine that would be aborgating part of our responsibility, because I think our responsibility at that time would be to inform the person as you have stated and then carry it further by bringing it to your attention. Councilman Nichols: You can take the exact literal inter- pretation of your role and say I am sorry that is not our job. Councilman Young: This happens all the time, all of us get calls on the Council involving and we don't go to that • specific personnel employee, we go to the out in the community City Manager with those things. Otherwise we are in trouble and the City is in trouble. Commissioner Cano: That is the step I think we should take at that time, the minute we have someone relaying a problem. I always feel the energy we expend at the beginning is a lot less than the energy spent later on. I would like to get a clear understanding of the problem and interpret it to the City Council or City Manager, or through whatever system we develop. Councilman Nichols: If I were a member of your Commission and somebody down the street came to me and said "listen I understand they are practicing racial discrimination over in the Parks Recreation Department" I would go right to the Chairman of my Commission and say do you think this has any substance, or is this guy a kook. And if he said maybe he does, well about that time I would call the Mayor or a City Councilman and pass it down the line to the City Manager, but I would not at that point take any action in my official role because then it comes a pre-emption of the Council role. Commissioner Teall: With regard to everybody sitting on a different Commission - do you suggest this is not a good idea? • Councilman Chappell: It was brought up at the meeting I attending and I think it was an informative type of thing. Some of you haven't been to a Council meeting other than to accept your appointment and I think it is. a good idea to go around and see how the other Boards and Commissions function so you are knowledgeable. Some of these meetings are very interesting. We don't want to make it mandatory and say you have to do that. City Councilmen all have assignments and if we can attend we go. It has to be voluntary. - 16 - CITY COUNCIL and Page Seventeen HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION MEETING 10/1/73 Mr. Butzlaff: As staff liaison am I allowed to say anything? (Permission given by the Mayor.) Iwould like to clarify one thing. As staff liaison I have been charged to represent staff at the Commission • meetings and be the liaison between the Commission and City Council, but one of the things the liaison is inevitably faced with, particularly in the Human Relations Commission because of all these delicate areas that evolve is to try and relate them to the original resolution. When it came to the area of Affirmative Action, and at this point is when I was essentially assigned to the Commission, this is sort of a continuous ongoing problem. It began last year and there was a realization that there was overlapping elements between the Human Relations Commission and the Personnel Board and ultimately working with Mr. Duvall we realized there was this overlapping and there wasn't anything that could be tied only to personnel work or only to the Commission, so we did appoint a liaison man - Fred Smith - to attend the Personnel Board meetings, and Herb Tice of the Personnel Board as liaison to the Human Relations Commission, to try and open up channels of communications between the two so they could understand their problems. In other words it is similar to the movement in Social Science now,. instead of one person being in Political Science and another person an Anthropoligist and each working in their own prevue there are problems with overlapping elements and both can approach. And this essentially was what we were trying to do. Councilman Nichols: Research and consultation areas, as you say have a different approach attached to it, I think it varies and in the • results where there is a question of authority attached at some point there has to be a definition as to the one that carries it and the one that doesn't and the associate has to give way to the directive role. I think when you talk about having the same kind of relief on the relationship we just finished discussing between the Planning Commission and the human conditions to give input, to get the benefit of their experience and background as a consultant to the City body, that is great, but when you get into the area of two liaisons operating a joint program supposedly responsive to uncertain direction that is Council direction, I think you are headed for trouble because the Personnel Board has to function as a Personnel Board and the Human Relations.Commission has to function in its role of human relations and tying any two Commissions. together through the liaisons that results in joint decisions as to which way to go each Commission can be diminished.in its role. I believe this Commission will invigorate itself in terms of its role and allow the Personnel Board to do the same and consult when consultation is requested and not attempt to act jointly. Where there are those things that come up I think it would be very wise for the Commission to seek the guidance of the Council. Mayor Pro tem Shearer: Does the Commission understand, .there was no disagreement with what I said what the Council would like from you - which is a proposal of what you would like to do, perhaps even a model ordinance draft perhaps along the lines stated by Councilman • Nichols, as soon as possible for our further action. That is clear? (No one opposed.) Is there anything else to come.before the joint meeting? We have another item on the Council agenda tonight, you are welcome to stay if you wish. Chairman Maeda: I am sure the Commission is all in agreement as to what we are to come up with and we appreciate this meeting with you. Commissioner Cano: I might state that the whole Commission - 17 - CITY COUNCIL and HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION MEETING Page Eighteen 10/1/73 was apprised of the fact that Mayor Lloyd would be out of the City on city business. Councilman Young: Viewing the minutes of a recent meeting where there was someaction postponed pending this meeting I trust the action of the Commission will now go forward as well as the other little study you are going to do. That is all I care to express about the Woodside Village School District problem. It is a distinct community problem and if you can come up with a scheme to bring Woodside Village into the West Covina School District..... Commissioner Smith: Mr. Mayor, I would like to make one comment, that is I have enjoyed serving.on the Human Relations Commission and I think West Covina is a wonderful City and proof of that that I really like West Covina is that I drive one hundred miles a day to get to work with the President of my company trying to move me out. I would like to say I have enjoyed working on the Commission and would like to continue serving. My interest is in keeping West Covina the leader that it is and looked up to throughout Los Angeles County. In my work with the County I am known as "that -guy from West Covina again" - they are always talking about West Covina does this and that. We are quite proud of what you gentlemen have devised for the City. (Chairman Maeda adjourned the Human Relations Commission meeting at 9:15 P.M.) LAFCO -.SPHERE OF Mayor Pro tem Shearer: This item is • INFLUENCE STUDY III - on the agenda because I believe I counted wrong.-. I called Mr. Aiassa after last week's meeting and he briefed me and said it was held over for two weeks and I added 2 and 2 together and figured tonight would be the only meeting we would have and it would have to be discussed tonight and later I figured out 2 and 2 is 4, so whether we want to proceed tonight with the discussion of this or defer it to next Monday when all of the Council including the Mayor who was at the last meeting of LAFCO to give him an opportunity to state his feelings in the matter. Councilman Nichols: I would accede to the majority. (Mr. Aiassa advised that the Council meeting will be held on Tuesday because Monday is a holiday.) Councilman Young: I think Mr. Lloyd has a great personal interest in this, he has attended all meetings, so I think in courtesy to him we should defer discussion at the present time, if we can do that without placing an undue burden on staff. Mayor Pro Tem Shearer: I would agree, if I can ask a couple of questions tonight of staff. (Agreed) We have some areas of conflict start- ing in the northwest corner, I believe the LAFCO recommendation was to split at the railroad and Vincent. The City of Covina wants it all. Mr. Zimmerman: That is correct. They want all includ- ing the part that was to go to Irwindale north of the railroad, excepting the area south of Badillo. Mayor Pro tem Shearer: The compromise Schabarum introduced was that the area had to go to both spheres of influence and anything �-Im CITY COUNCIL and HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION MEETING Page Nineteen 10/1/73 south of Badillo would be West Covina and north. would be Covina. Mr. Zimmerman: That is correct - and between Sunset • and Vincent. Mayor Pro tem Shearer: What really do we want? Mr. Zimmerman: In that regard I have to go into comments of the Commission which are not in the report and which I think are very important. The next step according to Mrs. Bonnell, after the spheres of influence are established and after possible annexations have been made to the cities based on the sphere of influence will be mandatory annexation and deannexaticn policies and that means that areas which are already ina City and seem to protrude.into,another would-be a deannexation and annexed to another City. She is admittedly looking to the future and reading the minds of the legislature; however she made that comment first at a meeting last January and secondly she made it last Wednesday after the Commission hearing in direct response to my question. So she is still of the same mind. If you look at the map you will find if Covina were to get all it wanted it would leave a long T shaped peninsula in West Covina including.our only industrial area, the Tribune Plant, which gives the City a lot of recognition and identity, in a little peninsula. So it seems to me Covina's real move was to gain our very important industrial area. Now there was an old agreement with Covina which was mentioned by one of the people from Covina a year • or so ago that Vincent would be their westerly boundary and that was staffs' proposal and the one we supported at the Commission hearing. The situation still remains no matter whose sphere of influence that goes in it can still be annexed by any City. The sphere of influence is only one piece of input and if the people want to go to another city they can. , Mayor Pro tem Shearer: That is under the present legislation? Mr. Aiassa: Yes, with the exception it has to be 100/. Mayor Pro tem Shearer: But that legislation as you already implied could be changed to make it mandatory legislation. Mr: Zimmerman: Yes, that is correct. Councilman Nichols: Well we already voted once to support LAFCO's recommendation! Mayor Pro tem Shearer: Yes, but I think we are at a point now if we feel it is important that we have to speak out more vigorously rather than say we support LAFCO and staff. I think we have to draw the line and defend it because of A, B, C and D - whatever they are. Councilman Nichols: I agree. The point was we are not talk- ing about some position exclusive of LAFCO, really what we are talking about is the reiteration of our previous vote in supporting as a rock bottom position the recommendation of LAFCO and yes, I am all for that, I think it is a reasonable decision, I think any person that was not involved directly with a community interest could see this is an objective effort to resolve these long term interests and I would not only go to the mat but ask you to help me up. - 19 - CITY COUNCIL Page Twenty SPHERES OF INFLUENCE 10/1/73 Councilman Young: I thought George stated some very persuasive reasons and this should be strongly urged. • Mayor Pro tem Shearer: I would suggest in this area for con- sideration of the Council and as stated by Mr. Aiassa when I talked to. him by phone this afternoon, that perhaps the two highest paid persons of the two cities get together and perhaps they can reach a compromise that would perhaps strengthen our position with regards to the T and square off the boundary a little more. Perhaps somewhat east, the dividing line might be Sunset, between now and next Tuesday. If this can be done, fine. If not, then perhaps we have to draw our own line and go back to the next meeting and say this is it because of the fire station, this and that, this is why we think it should be within our sphere of influence. Is that agreeable? (Agreed) • • The next area is the small one in the middle of the map, Hollenbeck. 'I personally see nothing to hassle over that. It means that if this area is annexed in accordance with the boundaries set we won't have to resurface any of the street, but on the other hand when our people complain the street didn't get swept we say that belongs to Covina rather than the center line. I think that was the rational for drawing the center line down the middle of the street, that at least the half of the street our people fronted on would be our responsibility to sweep, cut the trees and so forth. Mr. Zimmerman: Exactly. Councilman Young: I thought of that and thought we really ought to urge maintaining the responsi- the complaints. bility for our residents because we get Mayor Pro tem Shearer: Was this held over? Mr. Zimmerman: LAFCO did not hold this over, they decided on this. Mr. Aiassa: The only concession .they made was they did go to the property line rather than the center of the street. Mayor Pro tem Shearer: I can't understand why the City would want all that responsibility and no income. Maybe they want to close the street off or something. Mr. 't-iiassa: We have the same.problem on Cortez on the other side of Barranca. I think one of the questions confronting cities is when it is split in the middle in case of accidents you have two different cities involved, but I think it is rather trivial to worry about. (Mr. Zimmerman was asked to elaborate on what the colors on the map mean and he explained.) Mr. Zimmerman: The Cal -Poly Campus was passed on specifically by LAFCO and put in the sphere of influence of Pomona and this was because Cal -Poly has a portion of their campus now in West Covina, so you would split the campus. There was a switch on the cemetery. LAFCO's report indicated that should be in the West Covina sphere of influence and the area next to it in Walnut would be switched from - 20 - CITY COUNCIL Page Twenty-one SPHERES OF INFLUENCE 10/1/73 Walnut to West Covina. This was in the LAFCO report. There was a motion by Mr. Bond from Longbeach that suddenly placed it in nobody's sphere of influence and this was totally unexpected, and when . Mrs. Bonnell gave her report afterwards she indicated that she thought it should not be in anybody's sphere of influence. Then Walnut got up and both the Mayor and City Manager raised a con- siderable discussion about that feature of it and I got up also and indicated since some five cemeteries are in L.A. County that this one should be in the sphere of influence of some City. Later on LAFCO indicated it would make a reconsideration of this at its next meeting, two weeks from now, although it had passed that. Councilman Nichols: Its most recent decision was to remove the whole cemetery? Mr. Zimmerman: Yes, from any particular City. Mr. Aiassa: The written report from LAFCO was to include the cemetery in West Covina and the contiguous area but she made an oral report at the LAFCO meeting deleting Forest Lawn from anyone's sphere of influence. Councilman Chappell: Why did she do that? Mr. Aiassa: It is a hard thing to explain. Mr. Zimmerman: I think it was a spur of the moment thing. • C is the rest of the area east of Grand. The reason Grand is chosen as the boundary line is that Walnut said it wanted all portions of the area between the freeway and the top of the mountain east of Grand but left out anything west of Grand. That was again held over,. Staff's recommendation was West Covina plus part of Walnut, the Ridge line would be held. Mayor Pro tem Shearer: Was there any compromise offered on that? Mr. Zimmerman: None. Presentations on both and they held it over. Mr. Aiassa: Mr. Schabarum asked for a topo map, he wanted to see the water sheds, etc. Mr. Zimmerman: Area D along with 29 is all solidly in West Covina along with Walnut's agreement and Covina made no presentation on any of the areas of the freeway excepting for E.which is a walnut groove just west of Grand and the City of Walnut felt that should be in Walnut so they could make a part out of it. Mayor Pro tem Shearer: And we have no quarrel with that? • Mr. Zimmerman: I made a report on that. The comment was that this is all one large parcel of land and if you do that some of that large parcel would be in Walnut and some in West Covina which is not the best thing. Mr. Aiassa: I think this is why Mr. Schabarum wanted to see the topo map, how the water drains. And this walnut groove is setting towards West Covina and I think that is one of the strong points - who is going to handle that water? - Mr. Zimmerman: Baxter Ward and Schabarum both said they wanted to see a topo map. They do want 21 - • C CITY COUNCIL SPHERES OF INFLUENCE Page Twenty-two 10/1/73 . West Covina to show its desired line along the ridge at the next meet- ing. Mayor Pro tem Shearer: So the areas that are in debate would be between Walnut and West Covina - Area C. Covina made no presentation. Area E to a certain extent andArea B. What was Covina's position with the cemetery? Mr. Zimmerman: They made no comment with anything south of the freeway. Walnut said it should be in the City of Walnut. Mayor Pro tem Shearer: Why do we want the cemetery? Mr. Aiassa: There is revenue. Sales tax on caskets, flowers and also the area not developed is accessible. Councilman Chappell: Plus the fact we need a distinguishing landmark in West Covina and Forest Lawn is not a bad location. Mayor Pro tem Shearer: I think our argument is not going to be based on a sales tax basis, because what is good for us is good for Walnut. I think we would have to base our presentation on criteria - I assume there is criteria set up for this and that should be the basis for our presentation. Mr. Zimmerman: The position is weak from a technical sense because they have their own sewer system, and water system is California Cities which is private, and their transportation is directly to the freeway and they require very little.fire and police, although some and that is our strongest point. The fire station at Barranca and the freeway. Mayor Pro tem Shearer: I would throw out for consideration and direction to staff that between now and next Tuesday that you prepare, personally I would like to see what there is in the legislation that LAFCO is supposed to take into consideration when they determine who gets what, and then on each one of these areas in conflict a summary of the arguments. Emphasize the strong points and forget the weak points. And then next Tuesday we decide as a body whether we want to take a strong stand on Area B or C, or what we want to do. I think it should be based on the presentation we can make, I don't think we should get up and make a presentation that doesn't hold much water. If we have a strong point on C and not on B perhaps we should emphasize that and leave.that in nobody's influence. Mr. Aiassa: This property here in green that was originally the Bailey ranch and was supposed to be annexed to West Covina and was originally until this little group started in here and that included Forest Lawn. Mayor Pro tem Shearer: Unless the laws become mandatory we may never annex it anyway. Councilman Nichols: But by not taking any action we might foreclose any possibility. Councilman Young: I think you have stated a very reason- able approach. - 22 - CITY COUNCIL SPHERES OF, INFLUENCE Page Twenty-three 10/1/73 Mayor Pro .tem Shearer: If you can't work something out here that will strengthen our position then perhaps we should go through the same • listing of arguments so that who ever makes the presentation, which I assume will be the Mayor, can say okay we have this and that and so forth. Mr. Aiassa: We are going to take an aerial photo of that area this week. RESOLUTION OF COMMENDA- Mr. Aiassa: Mr. Bill Geller, TION The County Regional Librarian is retiring, he was the individual that worked with the City to build the first regional library. He actually retired as of September 30th but is staying on for one week to break in the new librarian. Councilman Chappell: I would suggest we give him a very nice West Covina plaque with his name engraved on -it. This seems to be what the .people like and I so move. Seconded by Councilman Young and carried. ADJOURNMENT Motion by Councilman Chappell, seconded by Councilman Young and carried to • adjourn meeting at 9:41 P.M. ATTEST: CITY CLERK Is APPROVED: MAYOR PRO TEM - 23 -