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06-05-1972 - Regular Meeting - MinutesJune 5, 1972 The Pledge of Allegiance was recited. ROLL CALL • Young: Aiassa: Mayor Young; Councilmen Shearer, Nichols Lloyd, Chappell George Aiassa, City Manager Lela Preston, City Clerk Leonard Eliot, Controller Mr. Aiassa, 751 Police is that where we are? Mr. Mayor, I'm going to let the city controller proceed -'-as he did last time. Eliot: Mayor and city council I would like to begin by correcting a statement I made the last meeting. In response to a question by councilman Shearer regarding revenue sharing. I was relying on a report given out by the National League of Cities that was a comment on the revenue sharing bill depending upon the congress. At that time I stated the bill contained a maintenance of effort clause. Since that time I have read a copy of the entire bill and maintenance of effort clause. It applys only to the state govenment and not to local governments and is intended to protect the cities against any reduction of state level is that the cities shall be able to reduce their own taxes by revenue sharing. We still don't know where it is pending. Account 751 the Police department. The staffing is consistant with last year except for 2 clerical positions we have been added. Those two positions were added under the pep program and are fully funded as you know from the emergency employment act of 1971. The Police department did ask for 4 additional police officers which was denied in the preliminary budget hearing. The increase is salaries therefore between this year and last year reflects the pep positions hired last year, plus normal step increases. The entire budget •for the Police department this year as you know it is the largest department. in the city is up $109 thousand over last years. Young: Thats without the additional 4 officers requested. Eliot: That is true. That is the preliminary columns itself to last years approved. Young: How much of one that includes that 100 thousand dollars would be assignable to the pep program. Eliot: Something like 69 thousand dollasr of the entire increases is atributable to the pep program. The principle one that I could mention is that we did add 2 police cars, black and whites, patrol vehicles to the budget this year. Lease costs, maintenance costs, gasoline costs, etc., have contributed a good share of the increase. One criminologist and one additional locational crossing guard was added this year over last years budget. Lloyd new fuels which apparently cost a lot 6n them. Aiassa: Lloyd: Aiassa: Mr. Aiassa, how far have you proceeded along speaking of gasoline costs? Have you proceeded toward this natural gas, less money and we don't face the taxation I've been getting a report. George, you have been getting a report for over a year. The problem that was facing us was the gas company was going to put a station supply and with the conversion of vehicles Page 2 we have to have those vehicles charged and we have to work with them pretty much on this basis. Now we have I believe 4 or 6 converted. Lloyd: What you are telling me then is that the gasoline company does not have adequant facilities to handle our vehicles. Aiassa: Well, its not a convenient or large • enough to convert a large fleet. Lloyd: Now a question I have is what would be the inconvience in police cars and would it be adequant method I realize of course, that we would loose maybe 10% performance of the vehicle. Since performance of a police car is not the ultimate as I am led to believe, that high speeds are no longer the key to it but organization and team work. It would seem to me that we could save money on this thing. A considerable amount on fuel alone because we would cut the cost of fuel alone per automobile by 50%. Aiassa: I couldn't give you any accurate dollars and cents figure unless we did a cost analysis to what has been our normal operational cost what the exsisting one will be using. Do that, with maybe 1 or 2 units and get some factorial cost. Lloyd: Well as I understand it some of the state vehicles and many of the County vehicles have been changed over. However, they have not been public safety vehicles. If 60 or 70:miles an hour or even 80 miles an hour is adequant then we can get the break off on this. I think there is a considerable savings that might be in this area and as I understand it from what you have here about 40 thousand dollars is the actual increase to the city. Is that correct? •Eliot : by the way cost the city 20� a gallon same as your pump price. That doesn't reflect primarily for gasoline costs thats for all kinds of lease costs, repair costs, etc. Gasoline for premium. So were not paying the Lloyd: Well is that the question that was asked? I am aware of that. I mean that wasn't the question I asked. Natural gas of course is below 10� so it does amount to a considerable savings. Aiassa: Well why don't I do this is to make an analysis and bring forth a factural report. Mr. Chester Shearer's car is gas operated. Shearer: Not anymore, I got a new one. Chappell: I would like to bring up one thing I was talking to one of our employees and the gas has not the facilities at this time. They go up and spend a tremendous amount of time hourly time sitting up there waiting. The fuel is not giving the performance they though we would have. I think these are the things we better look in to. �iassa: Thats part of the project that we are analysing the ones we have now. Because thats one of our keys to our conversion. Chappell: The truck has to go up there almost every day. Page 3 Lloyd: It does have to go everyday with compressed natural gas'. Aiassa: What we might end up doing if we could develop in and provide now we have legal zoning and other requirements, is to develop our own fueling station. That way our cars can be parked there during the night and can be serviced during the night. •Chappell: Aiassa: Lloyd: Young: once the aret becomes general only I'm sure willing to listen. Labor on some of the vehicles on the city might be quite costly. Let me make an analysis of it and brin.g.� back a written report. Thank you very much. I bet money that we find out that pioneering in the art will cost us far more than any savings we will get and then will it pay us to get into it. But Shearer: As long as were discussing exotic fuels I would suggest that you not limit your study to compressed natural gas. We are converting some of our vehicles to LPG propane. These do not require the duel system because the LPG capacity is equal to or slightly exceeds that of the full tank of gasoline. You don't have the problem of the duel system having to run our every 100 or 90 miles. And the fuel cost on a vast purchase basis is about 507o. So there might be some pssibility there. The cost to convert something like 3 to $400. •Aiassa: The state is now using LPG. Shearer: Orange County in fact there is a facility set up there that the City of Orange the County of Orange and the State Division of Highways all use the same facility. I'm not offering that but something might be worked out. And the people who use the LPG feel it is much superior to the compressed natural gas. Young: Eliot: over 12 thousand dollars, in the Shearer: Very well gentlemen, can we move ahead? Then the only other item that has significantly increased over the last year if the over -time account which is up police budget. for the 3 police officers is tied what are they doing? As I recall Now if it was necessary to disband in where did they go? Can I ask a question before we get into overtime on the basic staffing. Looking over the detail for the justification in with the 10-plan. We put on 3 pep officers they came on after the 10-plan was instituted. to get 3 bodies when the pep program came Eliot: This would be part of the implementation of the 10-plan program. The 10-plan program as in actually used more man flower than our former staffing system. One think it has done the actual working time has been reduced, the police officer on duty his time on briefing is now on city time under the 10-plan where as before he came to work in advance of his duty time. His actualy on shift time is 72 hours rather than 8 hours, because it is a paid lunch break. Again a difference from prior proceedure where actually using more personnel on patrol than we did under the old system.. We have also increased our over time for the same reason because of the 10-plan. It has actually cost the city something to go into it. Page 4 Shearer: My question has to do with 3 bodies we had a certain staff a year ago prior to the institution of the 10-plan. Now in order to staff the 10-plan were also absorved into the patrol program. They were not used to re -staff the SED program at the time. Shearer: So the 10-plan required an additional 6 personnel to provide a level of service • comparable to what we had before. Eliot: Yes, as the police chief determined the level that was needed. As a matter of information I have discussed with the chief and the deputy chief the possibility of taking desk officers out into the field and perhaps using some other mode of staffing our complaint desk. That is an area we are still exploring of getting as much as possible out of our sworn personnel. We have a Lt. in charge of our records bureau a civilian in many cities does that task so the same is true of complaint officers you can use retired officers of your force or other forces at much lower wage and corporation with the chief we will look forward to providing more officers in the field and replacing them with more civilian type employee at a lower cost to the city. So this SED program might be instituted by that means in the near future. Are there any further questions on the police budget? Aiassa: There is one other items for the Council's information we have temporily acitng Capt. as you know Mr. Hansen, we are determining retirement or not and that position is temporarily being filled by Mr. Goditer. Actually the analysis of the operations of the police department is going to have some phases that might be checked out as we are expanding and developing an in house program. And I think the desk officer. See when we went into central communications the desk officer was acting as dispatcher. It flew up as a savings when we centralized our commuications, then all of a sudden the chief and deputy chief at the time realized that they were short •.t the desk. Then for some time they were using kadets to help at the desk and act as desk officers but this didn't work to well because sometime the Sgt. or Lt. was called out and this would leave the kadet in a responsible position as far as the police station was concerned. So we are trying to phase out some of this. The 10-plan we get the max. number of police officers in the field in the area needed for patrol. Thats why we added extra cars. Now we are in the process under various programs of sending officers to school. And this does take time off for the officer. They are paid for their training and they get paid as far as the course is concerned by many times it takes 5 or maybe 3 weeks At a time for the officers to complete the course. This puts us into a little but of a bind as far as over time also sick leave and the rest of it. Now as you note in budget it is one of the largest operation section of the budget. And its 24 hours 7 days a week its a cost that going to be re-occuring and the councils is well aware of the CHP plan which in 1972 will have to be funded from the city. This is an early retirement plan for the police officer and they also included the city administration and city manager, as a second thought. The.1J npact would be quite expensive to the city to absorb this in our retirement plan. We almost have 30� tax rate taking care of these benefits. If these fringe benefits keep increasing from the state legislature without subsidy of funds or funding the burden of telling local government that you must provide this but there is no source of subsidizing as far as cost is concerned. PERS is already willing to absorb the difference of cost. Young: Are you telling us in essense that the local police department is rapidly becoming a thing in the past. Because e simply won't be able to afford it and will have in the past. Because state or county agency can provide police services as a matter of budget. Isn't that what we are looking at? Aiassa: Actually we are looking at two types of programing. One of them is the closer pacts between mutual cities where the surrounding San Gabriel Valley can relieve or over lap us in coverage. And then the other is that we have to determine what level of services we are going to Pa ge 5 maintain. Because you can go to an unlimited amount of actually personnel and each man that in the field has to be covered by communication and by steno and that increases the clerical work and also increases the over head as far as operation is concerned and were getting to the point were we have to determine what it actually cost to keep a man in the field. We have proposed working with the chief and deputy chief coming out with a budget that will be functional and keeping with the standards at the level we are now accustomed to it absorbs some of the extra costs and we feel for 1972-73 we can maintain a.reasonably �ood amount of service with this progarm, as long as the state legislature oes not impose added cost that we have to fund. Shearer: I would like some information obviously not tonight. How we stand with other cities not as far as salary but size of our police department and level of service. Which probably to me their are many levels of service the number of officers per population. This is something I have no idea where we stand. Sometime between now and the time we adopt the budget I would like a report that say compares West':Covina with Whitter, E1 Monte, and some of the adjoining cities. Are we wary out of line to high to low. I have a number of things'I've checked here but I don't want to go into any detail. I assume we can service the year with no money for traffic citation books or for batteries. This illustrates to me things I would just assume no get involved in I'm sure the police department will function somewhere there going to get traffic citation books. I would like some discussion for the 3rd year. I've been involved over vehicles. I see them again then I don't see them. Aiassa: To get into the vehicles as you remember we did purchase additional vehicles. We leased 14 and we bought 2 new satilites that we pressed into immediately in the detective division for 71-72. With anticipation fo 72-73 putting those vehicles as front line black and whites and we have an option to buy valiants that are now used as executive cars leased under the lease program at a lower price, at a reasonable lease price. Analysis Of the blue book and what value we are to purchase. I think you will see that shown into the account and these cars will be transfered into detective cars to reduce the two. The main thing that were trying to do is reduce the number of falcons that have now exceeded the time in years. That have been under service. But its rather difficult to replenish cars at a rapid rate at the cost of operation over head. But we are running the executive 2 years instead of one. This is somewhat of a savings. Now as you notice the police vehicles are running $294 a month and the 4 executive are $126 a month and then also we have a building option that a max at the time of---- to buy 1 or 4 of the present executive cars. So that will bring there complement up I believe there is a 14 detective cars, 16 patrol cars and we would just reduce or replace the 2 detective cars. Eliot: Was a spedifis question that you had Councilman Shearer? Shearer: No, I see in the detail I'm operating out -lays a request for 10 thousand dollars for replacement vehicles that are recommended item 22 hundred. How many vehicles will that provide? Eliot: That will provide 2 vehicles actually the item that the city manager referred to is that the detective fleet will be provided with 2 executive cars at the termination their lease on January 1, we Are an option with the leasing company to buy 2 executive cars at 11 hundred a iece or 22 for 2 of them. They will be put in to use in the detective fleet rather than buying new vehicles at 5 hundred a pieve we are buying used vehicles that we used our self that weill have less than 10 thousand miles on it for 11 hundred a piece. Page 6 Aiassa: The reason that we leased these cars as executive cars or even that police cars is that we find that if we get them factory equipment the price varies very little because now when you do buy cars that were driving in the staff executive cars which are valiants, do come with air conditioning, and AM radios are part of the expended equipment and the difference in price is so small its peanuts. �liot: Where there any further question on the automobile section, Mr. Shearer? Chappell: There's one little thing that was taken out in the budget about bumpers. We just bought bumpers. Eliot: Thats why. Shearer: There was a statement made I believe the first partof March not by one of the gentlemen up here, that the West Covina police department had no riot equipment. I see under operating out -lay a request for 3 thousand dollars considerable reduction. Is the fact true that the West Covina has no riot equipment. Eliot: That isn't quite true of course depending on what you call riot equipment. As part of the operational budget other than under out -lay where you are looking, under departmental supplies under 21 you find a good quanity of items such as mace, tear gas, theres also a separate item in account 61 this time for riot batons. Last years budget provided something like 17 thousand dollars for riot equipment. In addition when specific emergencies were to arise as they have a couple tines in the past year, they have made special purchases for items needed right then. We do 4iave supplies its difficult to say when you have an adequant level. Supplies e did expend constantly from our budget certain itmes that are certainly for crowd control such as I say, tear gas, mace, batons, etc. Chappell: They were being specific they were talking about a particular item about flack vests. Eliot: That is a separate item. That we buy every year parcticly we have , we do buty flack vests. Chappell: How many do we have do you know? Eliot: I wouldn't be able to tell you off hand the deputy chief is right here he could probably tell you better than I. HE SAYS TWO.':. Chappell: Thats not quite adquant do you think, Mr. Aiassa? Aiassa: Well when it comes to riot equipment its rather difficult there seems to be new enovations from experiences that other cities have experienced. And I think if an emergency came an appropriation would be necessary there to buy the equipment available at that time. I feel 0 hat would be the time that the city should decide. I just don't want to put thousand dollars in and then all of a sudden they develop a new riot equipment that would do what the 3 items we bought at half the cost. This is something the chief and my self and staff will have to look into and come out with some kind of program that will give us some kind of reasonable assurance. Matter of fact we hope our citizens of West Covina are sensable enough to not go into this big things like Oakland has and a few of the others because we would have to have a separate police force and separate budget that would mount up to hundreds of dollars. I think Berkely experienced a very shocking expense. Page 7 Lloyd: Mr. Aiassa, is some of that equipment like those flack vest similar to that of the army? Aiassa: Well they are chest shields that take a direct blow. I don't know if they will take a bullet. Oloyd: Is any of that avaiable from surplus? Aiassa: Well this one of the areas that we find we have funds in the CD and its under surplus and this is where we have aloud a certain amount -of money to sit. Lloyd: It its in surplus we can buy it like pennies on a dollar. And my recreation is so you spent a couple of hundred dollars on flack vests or even a thousand dollars at the point Mr. Young commented rather quietly to me and I would have to concur that certainly the piece of mind that it gives to your organization if some guys shooting at you. It costs so little. • Aiassa: Actually what were doing each year we keep increasing the inventory of items that we use. I think that what happens is like gas masks and things like you go threw a period of time where you have to replace them. I'd rather see us have a compact that will furnish enought people that will be necessary to penatrate that type of situation. Because for me to furnish this for the entire police force would be. • Lloyd: The question which councilman Chappell was referring to was is 2 of these items these flack vests sufficient. Aiassa: and alos if you.look in the we buy surplus sales threw Lloyd: Well we have $500 in here for safety shields and face shields and also gas masks so you have extra funds there civil defense budget there is a certain amount that CD sales. Thats what we look for. point of view policy and I think we don't want anyone to get hurt no major injuries. The point is year and if there is any question type of equipment. Well as long as you are looking for it and the chief of police and everybody is satisfied I would really as a council all of.us have been referring to it, is this, in the line of duty. Although we have had we have been exposed to it with in the last of that I think we should acquire that Aiassa: What were looking at to is that you notice in this years budget a rifle, 2 rifles, anti -sniper rifles and we have a few that will be added to the riot needs. Now I also have to qualify here that if were using equipment a rifle of the type that.is being considered here had a ---- experience in E1 Monte and if they start using armor percing shells that shell will travel some distance before it will stope. And sometimes it goes threw the object that has been shot and continues on. And this is one of the things that I want to be sure that the person who is given this responsibility is well informed and knows well the capacity of what that rifle is going to do. Now we are furnishing 2 rifles with scopes and these are for anti -sniper riots. Its a very difficult thing its like everything else you can exceed your self and I hate to see things being stored because they don't have any storage place. I see 10 gas masks from worn out units and thats $420 and its one of those things thats going to determine what coming forth in a year or so. Nichols: Its always a dramatic thing to stand in front of an audience and say our police department only has 2 or 3 flack vests or we don't even have one armoured car in the city or we have no well trained bomb disposal squads, etc. We could go on and on to where we almost created a small army in West Covina. But we are really operating a police department, these rare emergencies where there are major riots or where there are mass uprisings to the point where masses of our uniformed people must be protected in some unusual way. These things are rare indeed and the mutal aid pacts that exsists, exsist for the purpose of providing mutual assistance. I wonder for instance how many times in the history of West Covina has it been necessary for more than 1 or 2 men to put on a flack jacket and expose themselves into a situation of danger. I don't recall that those eposidoes have occured so far. I recognize when one tends to take the position I do here that we have to take a balanced approach to these matters that then one tends to place in a position �f criticism for not properly respecting the safety and lives of our city employees. And yet I think its responsibility of the management of the city and the council to take some sort of prudent middle ground approach to these things. If we begin really filling what we might say as the ultimate needs of our department we could probably add another 100 thousand dollars to our budget very readily in having available type of equipment and specialized personnel for these unusual circumstances. I feel in terms of the total strengency of the budget in terms of city I feel the police department budget and looking at all of the needs of the city probably those things that are being recommended are reasonably well thought out and I certainly go along with the recommendations that we have before us tonight. Young: Alright gentlemen, do you wish to move forward? Eliot: 801 is our next budgetary account tonight thats our public service area. This is primarily the office of the public service director and his immediate staff. There is virtually no change from last • years budget the only increase in salary is the secretarys step increase. Other than that there is almost identical budget with last years. Last years budget was approved at $38,040 and this years $38,743. Young Lloyd: that secretaries somehow be highered not picking on anyone. Any questions gentlemen? I know this comes to a shock to you, 9 thousand dollars for a secretary thats really kinda high isn't it. I do believe less than 9 thousand dollars. And I'm Aiassa: I think a factor is that shes in the highest E step it thats 3 or 5 years to reach there. And the present secretary shes only given a 22 per cent differential and that is if there is going to be only service director would be removed. See his actually acting as assistant city manager. And the 2 ddifferential is subject to. Now if we amend the position where the department only super ----- not complete. Lloyd: Lets go back to what the question really is, Mr. Aiassa, and it is should a secretary be paid $8928, or $8500 or anything in this category. I bring it up every year and every year I seem to be alone on it. I believe there are certain people who are in reality •administrative assistants, and if indeed they are I think they are I think they should be called administrative assistants. Lets call them what they really are. And then why can't we back the salaries down. I'm will to take the howl if thats what it has to be. We are paying the market value secretary. Don't tell me we are equal with other people because the equality part seems to be selected. There selected on the basis of some criteria that I don't seem to understand. Which is I can go in the market place and get adequant secretary help at 6 thousand dollars and we are looking at 8 thousand. That has nothing to do with it maybe these people are making decisions which require this king of payment. And if indeed they are then I have no objection to there being paid that. But I object strenouly to them being called secretaries. The people I call secretaries type letters, take dictation, and handle filing, and answer the phone. Now if those categories are the things that we are filling then I think these prices or salaries are simply out of line. If on the other hand if there duties require that I think they do in some of the cases then I want another name. You can call them lots of things but don't call them secretaries. I am really deeply offended by this. Young: Just one cautioning thought though, I would think of off hand once we tack on the administrative assistant title which of course a real good secretary would rate thats been around a long time would probably deserve it. But the pressure is immediately on to keep booming right on up. Maybe we are getting a better buy than we deserve for the money. Its just a thought..... •Lloyd: In some cases I think thats true. Thats certainly probably true in the case of Eileen. Aiassa: Actually you are only talking about 4 people. Two of them are in 2 key positions and 2 are not. The question my secretary is an exempt position so she actually an administrative secretary in job desription and her salary is predicted on that basis. Now she cannot function JD as an analyst or a Jr. analyst because that classification thats idenified for itself. And it usually requires a special degree and a specialtraining. This is where I get my recruit to make city managers. Which we now have 3 of them.. Lloyd: Thats irrelevant, George, what I'm talking about is secretaries. There are not just 4 there are many more that are receiving in excess of 6 thousand dollars a year. And I think we are pretty hard pressed to justify salaries for secretaries at that level. Aiassa: Well, one of the things that we might have fallen a victim to is that as you know over the years and you know that you are going to have pressure put again to you this year. Is that these positions were established on the 50 or 60 per centile and lets say that the persons that are now occupying these positions are in the E step and every year you are looking at the E step plus what ever cost of living raise you decide to give them and if by chance a retirement or vacancy occurs they go back to a A step. Its considerably lower by far than what they are showing these max. positions they are now. And most times I think in governmental agencies is there a tendency that supervisors tend to rotate into key positions I notice it very readily in County and also somewhat in the state. And that is the secretaries retain the continuity of the department because they are the ones that take the time to train new supervisors. Lloyd: George, excuse me for enterupting, my question is and I would like to here some other comment from the rest of the Council. It maybe that I'm totally out of line. We are not worried whether or not a secretary provided continuity or not the continuity that she provides reguards to your administrative analyst or Jr. analyst as they go up the line. •We make the assumption that we pay somebody 25 or 30 thousand dollars a year that they can pick up the ball and run with it if they can't we got the wrong man anyhow. We are now discussing secretaries and I grind on secretaries salaries which are of excess of 6 thousand dollars. Don't think I have anything against women because I certainly don't I'm all for everybody getting what they can, but I think we are paying an excessive amount. I always felt this way I don't think it comes as a shock to anyone that I feel this way. I find it difficult even the salaries I see here for evensome, well lets get down to the facts the secretary thats working for Bob Fast when I compare some of the people in my office and the load that they carry. And I pay a heck of lot less for it and frankly I don't know this lady very well but I think the people I have in my office are not only just as adequant I happen to think they are better. And I for one feel that we can get these people at a lesser rate. Maybe she's performing a job that I really don't know about. But off hand I'm saying we pay to much I will come back to a thing I saw at NBC they flat out said 50 bucks is tops for a secretary. They didn't care who it was and when the president and Vice President had his secretaries she was an administrative assistant. Beyond that level anyone else didn't like it, out, gone. And they filled it with somebody else aiid I think there is a possibility this can be done. Now I think for instance there are jobs you want to talk about planning, talk about police work where the training concept that goes into says should keep those people because of money. I honestly don't think there is a great deal of difference. I'm not putting anyone down. Between the person who types on one type of typewriter or who types on another. Thats what I'm talking about. I would like to here some discussion on that. • Young: Well I personnaly would not intrude that far into the daly working of the city and the daily workings of offices. I haven't gone around to offices and run any efficiency checks I feel there is a tendency to see these salaries get out of hand as we move along. On the other hand I don't feel that qualified to pass judgement on specific cases. I have a secretary secretary that worked for me for 9 years who is making somewhere in the neighborhood of 9 thousand dollars a year plus certain other benefits when I'm able to extend them. So I don't know what else to say J/ it can get out of hand but I think ultimately when it gets down to specifics I have to leave it in the hands of the city manager. Chappell: I've been sitting here because I express this before Jim but the thing about it is that, I know from what is paid in private enterprise doesn't compare anywhere near what they are being paid here. Maybe • a legal secretary may have more ability but I look at people in my office that are highly competent and have 4 or 5 hats on everyday I'd have to go out of business if I paid this kind of a salary. But I don't know what we can do about it. I think Jim we have talked about it and you and I have agreed on it many times but I don't have the answer and I think everytime we give a 8 thousand dollar person a 22 raise or you get them up there so fast it hurts. And I think thats happening. These increases as they come along through the years is just bult these jobs up to where there are above what you could find in private enterprise. And get the same results for less money. I just hope my girls don't find out what they are paying over here. Because I'm sure they'd like to come applying right away. Thats the way I feel about it, but I've never been able to come up with an answer how we over come this. Unless we were to freeze those areas until inflation brought the thing back in level. I don't know.. Nichols: Mayor, there are ways of course these matters can be handled you can simply freeze employees in these categories Y rate them and as you replace on a different salary schedule. The thing that I conclude here today is that were not going to get anything solved the problem here today during the budget dilberations. But everytime that we have looked at the budget the subject of secretaries salaries seems to come up. Then it dies down for 6 or 8 months then starts looking at the budget then the matter of secretaries salaries comes up again. I would suggest that the council might well direct staff in the piece and tranquility of the post adoption era on the budget that the staff indeed go into detail study in depth of secretary salaries structure both -'.in government and private industry and be prepared at some appropriate time, not in the indefinte future to come back to the council with some meat and potatoes of data and then lets put this on the agenda some night and study perhaps and look at it and hastle it around and see if there are answers as we a council feel that we sould come up with at least we be able to absolve it so that Jim's indignity can go into privacy or be ordained in some way. Eliot: Next budgetary would be 802 which is Engineering department. This is as you know a major department. Again there has been no staff increasing over last years level. Increase in salary amounts reflect the addition of 3 pep people that had been vacanted as of the end of last years budget. Staffing stays identical as far as the number of positions is concerned. And there are no sufficant increases in material and services. Operating out -lay represents a rise of 900 dollars over last year which is not very large item. Young: Is the staffing of this department to some extend or the work load vary with the and the building process. number of building permits. Will it not Aiassa: This staff works with the Engineering structual such as storm drains, streets, and design work the building and safety department is the one with the building permits and a building structures. This is strictly surface or beneath surface constuction. Young Aiassa: So its still tied then with to what we have in the way of capital expenditures. You are referring and looking at the last 3 years because of our capital improvement program and has been restricted. Young: And does the staff reduce accordingly. Aiassa: Yes, we have, you'll notice there are certain positions that is being recommended we will probably delay the • employment of civil engineer associate. Is that were we have the vacancy? Chappell: Where are the ones we cut out last year? Eliot: These are the 3 that have been replaced with pep individuals these are the item 30 a civil engineer assistant. Pep 5 is one employee and principle engineering aid is 2 employees. Aiassa: The pep program is the retraining of private industry public service and thats why the government is subsidizing require staff time to work with these employees to retrain them. Jeff here orginally came in threw the pep program now he is an analyst Jr. and eventually will strive to be an analyst. And he has to go threw all the requirements of city employment. And if he stays on the pep program he will only stay as long as the program surives. And as referring to Mr. Chappell that is that if the funds cense, these positions will also cense. Young: Eliot: Alright anything further on Engineering? Street cleaning will be 810,. Aiassa: The only increase here is bhown in our over -time and normally this equipment brought out when we have major accidents. • Where actually the sweeper is out of operation or brought into serve special operation. Primarily we have been very consistant as far as the over time is concerned. Because I think in this years expenditure....... Young: Mr. Aiassa, not to get us off into an tangent at the moment. There has been some complaints as you know, from the dust at the Home Savings lot. I'm just looking out the window checking on Jim Lloyd and the area between state street and service its just a free for all. Cars coming and going all the time. And I haven't checked into it but I heard a rumor which might be worth looking into is to put a fence around that. Aiassa: an immediate relief will across there now. Young: Aiassa: We have already explored the rumor and Mr. Zimmerman has been working with a representative from Home Savings and for probably have to baracade those established routes be a more permanent solution. • Chappell: Young: All I want is just a total route. About.115 years ago we had a sa.milar problem were the lot above it. And we baracaded it and I think the wall might That will only relieve part of it that loose dirt as the wind blows. You got to do more than just baracade. Get a car threw there and you really got the dirt. Well I didn't mean for us to get on discussion of this. /3 Aiassa: Mr. Zimmerman is devoting, well have an answer for you. Because it scatters dust all over creation. And then when the street sweeper comes up it scatters it again. Aiassa: Well actually the street sweeper is equiped with a spray front. Matter of fact if I don't notice any street sweepers • running where there is dust accumulating around the sweeper I usually make a note and see what unit it is and it usually is a fouled up sprinkler system. There is a separate sprinkler system in front to keep the dust down and its aggravated by the gutter brooms.and rear sweeper. And there is a dragging unit in the middle that keeps the dust from penatrating threw the unit. And if the equipment itself is not operating properly then it is either the fault of the operator or the street superintendent, not saying that the equipment is not kept in first class operating condition. Shearer: Aiassa: really had an experience. Chappell: Young: *Aiassa: you have a sum amount on your summary The way to eliminate dust on vacant lot would be ---- We had an awful time with tumble weeds I tell you one year after state ---after the tumber weeds started rolling we Home Savings and Loan enlarged there parking lot and in doing so they graded the whole area. I would just discourage traffic. There must have been a car every 10 seconds cutting across there today. The next item is 820 the largest in the street program. Mr. Eliot has a comment on item 53 on contractual. I believe sheet of 117 thousand and 245. Eliot: I made a comment that we will be proposing that the additional 20 thousand dollars be eliminated from that and the purpose is budgetary. Just referring to what I said a moment ago about the use of gas tax funds to the use of there up most. The park fund is also one that is levied by the council and therefore we are attempting to relieve as much pressure and therefore the median strips are acceptable for gas tax funds in so far as maintenance is concerned. And we have been able to determine just with in the last couple of days with the park department that they can justify an additional 20 thousand dollars of gas tax funding for the median strips. And therefore we are preposing to cut 20 thousand dollars from the street repair activity and transfer that as funding from the park amount of money for median strips but just changing the funding from the park fund to the gas tax fund. But this will mean a new amount of $97,240 being available on account A-1253 this again is a large scale project $53 thousand appropriated from last year has not yet been actually expended but has been encumbered and held til this coming year so that one program that was presented to the Council about 2 years ago. This will complete phase one and launch us into phase 2. isAiassa: This program will go into your local limited streets. Eliot: It will be as the city manager indicated both secondary and subdivision streets which are getting pretty old. Young: You say that we can anticipate a reduction l� of 93 thousand dollars in this budget is that correct? Eliot: 20 thousand dollars. It is using 20 thousand dollars of gas tax funds that we originally thought to use in this account. That instead we are using to fund our park operation so far as median strips are concerned. Which has a chess board or domino effect in that it would relieve the park fund from funding that much of the median •strips maintenance. Actually we are not increasing the budget we actually decreasing the budget by 20 thousand dollars in the total by a transfer in funding. We will end up 20 thousand dollars less expended in the street department. Which you are looking at. And the same amount expended in the future. The only thing is that the funding will have been changed. We attempted to use as little as possible of park fund money where ever we can use some other types of funding. Aiassa: So your net amount that object 53 would be $97,245 instead of $117,245. Mr. Chappell under 12 object worksheet 43 we show you the total truck depression in the yard. Which amounts to about 19;:thousand dollars so that means all these units over a period of years replace itself as far as we figure usability of that equipment. Now on the amount of money had been raised we normally will discontinue the depression reduce it to a nominal amout because there is no point for collecting extra funds as long as the vehicle performs. I think right now we do have a fleet of 1st class equipment which gives them better performance and less break downs and better service. Shearer: I notice on the summary worksheet A there was an amount 120 thousand dollars financed out of the capital out -lay fund which was reduced I assume this was the difference between requested and proposed in the street maintenance amount. • Eliot : Shearer: Yes, this is the amount our gas tax wouldn't carry any farther. Had to be funded by another source. Eliot: Yes, we could do that as you are undoubtely aware of the 2107 is available for maintenance without any limitations what so ever. So therefore as far as 2107 is concerned we deleat a capital improvement project and put more money into maintenance. Aiassa: We could postpone a capital out -lay program. Eliot: I would like to add in addition to the amount shown under 53 that under the accoun- number 21 supplies and services you will find a large amount of asphalt materials being purchases. Our own street crew using the large box that we bought them about 2 years ago. Have gone to much more progressive program with out own crew. Our work has increased tremendously with our own people. And wotking with engineering department we are talking about street department we are embarked on a large inadequant maintenance program in the city as reflected on 5 year study that was given to council. • Aiassa: I think the 3 year program as it was outlined was like the riot equipment. If we gave all the money we could get we could probably really Now some of the street will have to be 'sealed to hold over till next year or the following year depending on the condition of the face and surface. One of the things for example worst portions we have on Lark Ellen is between Vine and Merced. There has been so much excavation done in there by ultilities and etc. that the street now is.degeriorating and the crow is off now. For example when we did the construction work on Merced from Valinda to Lark Ellen we had to drop the /5 center line about 18 inches. Now we ended up exposing a storm drain. Same think on Cameron we dropped Cameron 8 or 12 inches were county street and old county theory was to build high crowns and slope them off because the water would run off and keep the street dry. Young: I guess we are fortuate in a dry year that rain is as hard on streets as any • thing. Aiassa: Yes, one of the most crucial things we have is the open street, normally they call it crocodile hide. And that is where you see cracks appear in the middle of the pavement. That means the water penatrating into the base and eventually you are going to have a hole. And also the oils after certain amount of exposure to the elements, looses adhesion to the gravel and aggragate. Have a tendency to have a hare non - flexible surface. So when the trash truck goes over it they are bigger than they use to be or any of the types of vehicles that go over it you have a startage for breakage everytime we excavate we have utilities. It just kills me to see a new street layed all of a sudden have a utility truck drive up and get the jack hammer and cut a hole in it. Young: It kills us all it threatens to kill us plictically on occasion as a matter of fact. Aiassa: We got.tquite a jolt once we tried to cover all the -man holes and we sent out the crew and has about 25 to 30 phone calls said- well typical political program say you start a new street and they are out there with a jack hammer putting holes in it. What really we were doing is raising the man holes to meet the needs of the surface because •there is about 4 inches. What you do is pave over them and dig them out then put bricks or what ever is necessary to brace them. Lloyd: somebodys back with the jack hammer. Aiassa: Young: Eliot: I know they did that on my street and I thought they had lost there minds. Pave the street then less than 2 days later We do that for the cut out valves for fire hydrents and things like that. Gentlemen, anything further on street repair? _ Next budget would be 14 sewer maintenance. Aiassa: Now this one as the Council knows we withdrew from the County, the service of our own sewers. But we found out that we were paying a very high rate for old city's like San Gabriel and Covina and were our system was partically brand new. We were not getting enough attention that we could normally render ourselves and would also help subsidize our street group by giving us added equipment, that would ecomnoically were running pretty well consistently from the last 2 years. I think this is our 3 year we are going on our own and we have had no major sewer stopage or anything. • Eliot: There is furtually no change from last years budget the only thing in salary account is that the 1 position last year started in Sept. 71 for 3/4 of year. Therefore now it is budgeted for the full year that makes the difference of 4 or 5 thousand in your salary account. Beyond that there is nothing significant. Young: And if we were on the old system with the County doing this how much would we spend. Have any idea? A�l Aiassa: Eliot: Well I think they have raised there rate, twice. Our 4� and approximately 1� below the County. Yes we are under that in addition we are giving much better service. Aiassa: We are buying speicalized equipment as you • see in your object 33 that your depressing unit 13471 and 1 unit 198 are rather expensive capital out -lay and over a period of time these will be depressiating out and the city will have new equipment. 816 this is your street trees and as you know it use to be under the park and recreation but we find its alot more efficient to put it all under 1 operation and the street department is handling everything. But the park way trees and other items of that nature come out of this budget here. I want to complement the school districts they planted trees in front of their schools which they didn't have 2 or 3 years ago. Now new trees we are buying a few larger size in the 15 gallons. -.-We find that the larger trees have a greater chance of survival than the smaller tree and that probably less chance of vandelism. Chappell: Were we able to save the trees being torn out by the widening of the freeway? Aiassa: Well we have a real problem and we talk to nursery people and they usually discourage you to take trees out and replace them in location. Because normally a speciman tree should be under warranty at least a year. Your chances for survival are pretty rough. Young: I suppose it be to late on the remainder of the xcavating of the trees to just simply make it available to the public • if they want tb come down and take a chance on it. Aiassa: I feel that this is an area that the contractor has jurisdiction on that because you can delay him indefintely trying to select trees and so the insurance factors and the liability factors once those people start getting into that area exposed to max. and so is the state division of highways. Thats why its usually best to buy one of those specimen trees at a nursery and you can get a year guarantee and they replace the one in front that everyone razzed me about. We have 2 beautiful pine trees for the same price. Young: would have thrown me in the clink for it goes. Lloyd: That are system if I had been caught out there the night before digging up one to take it home. I believe they thievery, trespassing so thais the way The responsibility of any trees that you plant responsibility of the people to who's house. Aiassa: Its a legal question. I think that the courts have proven that any time the city plants a tree and in a city park -way in city right of way that, that tree is the jurisdiction of the city. Now thats • when we had the bidg hastle with Mrs. Kelsy, Silver Maple that Russ Nichols well remembers we even made television that year. They were going to remove 5 thousand trees it became a symbol that we were going to tear out the city of 5 thousand trees. Ended up that we experimented and pruned about 20 of them and there almost back to the size they were orginally. Also the volianteer request is quite expensive to replace those specimen trees. A Silver Mapel is a very deadly tree, first of all its rapid growth, extending roots, /7 and ridgidness as far as branches are concerned. The only safe way to maintain these trees I have a Silver Maple on my property, I spend private money to spray it and I had it day -lighted every 2 or 3 years were the inside wood is taken out and the branches are left to the wind can go threw with out wipping them. Some of the cities in the older sections of California have now gone threw a replenish program as they plant new trees in between the old trees give the new trees an opportunity to get a certain height then they remove the old trees which are destroying private property, sidewalks, storm drains, • and all the rest of that, I think a perfect example of that is La Verne with their Pepper trees. Several major streets in La Verne,.sidewalks and curbs are just like this and city is liable. The moment somebody stumbles and some attorney happens to have a quick client. Lloyd: It the roots of the tree is planted by the city on a city park way and grew into private owner property, do they have the right to remove those or not? Aiassa: Well the normal proceedure is we usually wait for request for removal for example if somebody does have one of these problems the first thing we usually attempt to do is sheer off those roots if they don't make the tree unsafe. In some of the other cities I've been in we have gone so far as to lift up slabs of concrete sidewalk and literally remove the roots, sand pack the sidewalks and put the slab back. Lloyd: What I am trying to determine is the responsibility. Does the home owner have the responsibility for the maintenance of the tree as far as watering or any of that is concerned? Aiassa: Well normally a city should take the responsibility of maintaining And keeping those trees in which it plants. But • also you realize subdivision maps and final accepted maps the sub -divider - plants trees in the parkways. Now when it comes to private property its a questionable item. I believe in the case that Mr. Lloyd just pointed out, we would have to determine whether the city does have a liability. It normally ends up in a civil suit of some kind of there is extensive damage. I presume the proof is who planted the tree whos:care and liability was involved to take care of it. That was one of the items I think the park and recreation commission made quite a issue on Silver Maple they could see the liability so we had a problem. Shearer: Aiassa: Shearer: Aiassa: an issue on Cameron Park we had some Shearer: • Aiassa: Shearer: Aiassa: the city streets and tried to Special to ------- palm trees on Lark Ellen. No we haven't I wish we could. I'm just kidding. Those are one of the most controversal issues that I reached when I came to West Covina and matter of fact there was Italian Cypress. Does this account 816 cover maintenance of park trees or is this strictly street trees. Strictly street trees. Do you have any idea how many trees we have There was done 3 or now has a identify. an inventory I think it was 4 years ago and street department map. We actually went up all Shearer: Do you have that -figure? to know which trees are street trees.,, I would like classified as Aiassa: No, I don't have it available but I think I can make it available. We did go out I think what happened I think its one •of those unfortunate incidents is that at the time we allowed the selection of trees we had 5 and we discovered way to late that 2 of the 5 should never have been planted and what happened is the 2 that were.not desirable parkway trees after studies were more economical, they grew faster and they are attractive trees. I still say I don't care what ever statics show they will not remove my Silver Maple even if I have to rack leaves in the winter time, I still think it is a very beautiful tree. But you have to care for it. I Have to spray it and I have to hire a private tree surgery for pruning and which amounts to about $80 between my 2 front trees and back trees. Young: Mrs. Bergman did you have a comment you wish to make? Mrs. Bergman: When the survey is made and the Silver Maple is found undesirable I called the Park department ' -to relate to fron of my own house I wanted to have that tree removed and at the proper time the tree be selected for the area be planted I would pay the difference for the next size tree for the one that would be planted. I was told that Tulip trees would go in there. I am now 5 years later and have never had a contact back if the larger tree is available. Is the Tulip tree now an exceptable tree? Aiassa: Yes, the Tulip tree is.still exceptable and also the magnolia. There is a list and now your particular case was a specific question. If we put in a box tree which would probably the difference • in growth and size you would have 1 tree. Suppose everybody else in the block removed their tree. Mrs. Bergman: Everybody else still has Silver Maple. So I have a bare lot. Aiassa: Yours is vacant. Mrs. Bergman: It is bare because I am waiting for some kind of a plant. I haven't pushed it. I is a water public. would really like to know whether there Aiassa: Yes, there is for the down town commercial area where there is no facility for watering Which now our new precise plan and ordinance requires that they do provide automatic sprinklers. We try to keep them at a safe height so they aren't hitting street sweeper. We prune quite a few trees. I think we ought to check your case. Young: Mistakes are made like fools, like we, but only God can make a tree. Lloyd: The question was I never did hear the answer. If someone will pay the difference • and will you allow them to do it. Aiassa: We had this case brought before us. It is a policy matter and I believe I'm going to have to have a meeting with Mr. Zimmerman and determine the differences in size. Young: Perhaps you could give me a recommendation on that if its a matter of policy we should consider it at council it seems lT perfectly reasonable to me. Aiassa: Right now we are faced with a difficult task and I think probably Mrs. Bergman realized is with the number of trees and the amount of care we have to give the parkway trees now our office is partically quite extensive. • Lloyd: Question: Will you if someone will pay the difference give them the next larger tree? Eliot: Thats are present policy. The present policy is the 15 gallon can that you marked there is available to the home owner for paying the difference between the 5 gallon size and the 15 gallon size. Lloyd: What if they want to go to a 50 gallons. Eliot: We have not yet had that request. There has been no policy on that. I assume the City Managers office would have to decide that. Aiassa: One of the items that come up and I think its a item that has to be determined by policy what limit size tree are you going to permit to be planted in that area, Because the larger specimens often survive better but they.klso need care. Young: Is there anything further on trees? • Aiassa: 821 is traffic.iengineering. This is mostly funded by gas tax funds. And we are actually limited to want we can expend certain funds for in this particular category. The budget itself I think reflects the increase and theres a very limited service reduction of 575, but an increase from 71-72. The capitol out -lay there is $6910 and break down it shows you its a replace I think of an old piece of equipment services and this is where jointly the city and state maintain signals, city and county maintain signal and cities other than West Covina maintain signal such as Covina. And then also we have the maintenance of 10 traffic counters and also 1 radar unit. Now the capital out lays 10 inductive loop detective amplefilers, 6 pedestrian heads and frame works 1 telephone slave unit, lminor movement control, 5 fail safe systems monitors, etc. Lloyd: How many siliscopes do you have? Aiassa: I think this is the only one. Lloyd: Your radio man must have a siliscope, you do have a radio man? Aiassa: He is maintenance. Its a maintenance service. Eliot: Are radio man is half time on the traffic lights. He does have his equipment to • use in both areas. Lloyd: He already has a siloscope right? Aiassa: No, we don't have one. Lloyd: You mean the radio man doesn't have a siloscope how is he able to operate? • Aiassa: We have a contract for maintenance o� the radios and normally if the units go out there just, we have a spare unit to replace it and we take it in for service. Young: I thought we had a big hastle over this siloscope business some few months ago. We discussed on the Agenda for buying one. Lloyd: I think that was a guy talking about it was a meter a frequency meter. Young: Its not the same thing? Aiassa: This kind of a meter or unit is used to give a ----- Lloyd: All I'm saying is if your radio electronic gear the only way you can maintain it is you have to have a siloscope. And one siloscope kinds does for everybody. Aiassa: This is what going to happen is probably charged to traffic engineering will be under the jurisdiction of radio traffic. Young: Also are we going to make a deal to offer our service to some of the surrounding cities. Aiassa: Yes, we already have 2 cities we have contracted with on the radio program with the maintenance service man. Shearer: I can't find the guy who repairs traffic signals. Aiassa: He is under city yard. Eliot: He's under account 822 we split traffic into 2 parts the last year 821 is the engineering part and 822 are the men who actually work in the field and do the maintenance of traffic signals. And they make the traffic signs as well. So that would be the next budget you look at. Maintenance man 3 is a man who goes out and does maintenance but is not the man who does the electronic work. You find him under communications I'm afraid under account 721. Shearer: Eliot He does both radios and traffic signals? Yes, he does. Aiassa: We have a man that works in the city yard and I think he is;.under city lighting. And his assignment is to actually keep going on traffic signals. George Zimmerman do you --remember? Eliot. being charge to civil defense again equipment. We call him communication tech. He is listed under account 721. He is listed there as 1 full man and z of him is because of civil defense electronic Aiassa: I wan to make a correction. We have a correction made the state civil defense that according to there governmental ruling that this man doesn't meet the qualifications that would permit us to be subsidized by the state and federal funds, under CD. So they are now ,21 getting very restrictive in civil defense funds. We have to supply an afirmative program by July 1, to be eligible. Lloyd: I'm very weary of that affirmative program. Its terms of affirmative action and we can get baried on it. Before this city goes into any affirmative action program I don't care what the rest of the council does but I think,------. Because it is crocked with a great deal of danger. Aiassa: If and when it does go threw we will have to go threw personnel board and from administration to personnel board, personnel board to the council. But we have to under the program to recieve federal funds. This is their program. Lloyd: Thats a program before we go leaping into it. I want a briefing on it. Aiassa: You will, we are now in the phases of doing analysis on it. I think what Mr. Lloyd is leading to and I think if you've had any experience with some of the agencies surviving soley under federal dontracts that there really getting tied to the nitty-gritty, that thier actually running the personnel administration. Lloyd: Aiassa: are going got enough • presume we Shearer: Eliot. Thats exactly right. I think this is a point where we will probably have to decide what road we are going to cross. How restrictive they to be and if there to restrictive were just say no. Because I've paper work now with out spedding extra hours. Mr. Shearer I answered your question. time between the 2 radio repair work. or truck there its Aiassa: Shearer: Aiassa: Shearer: Well I'm not sure. Is the communications expert he is my exclusive radio tech. also: Yes, he is. The radio tech. was origian113 hired for that purpose. And that is why we originally hired him was to split his tasks. Was to service the in city signals as well as do When the signals go out in the weekend and you see a car usually our man there. Are you talking about the individual that goes up to the traffic lights and changes bulbs. I'm talking about the guy when the traffic signal get stuck and won't operate who un-sticks it? We have a maintenance electrician. He is under city yard 849. There seems to be a difference of opinion. Aiassa: I think the one that Mr. Eliot is • referring to is the master control units which is the box control units. Then we have the signal itself in the middle of the street which requires maintenance cleaning and up keep and electrical service. And the maintenace electrian does basically all the work. We were having an outside contractor giving us emergency services like for example Sunday the traffic signals went out. Now normally if its not a serious problem like a master control box we usually CXl phase it out to 4 way stop or else physically man it by policeofficers. Now the maintenance electrian usually does the routine maintenance of traffic signals heads, bulbs, and things like that. Now the master control boxes themselves usually don't require much care except for phase changing and are traffic engineer usually works directly with the maintenance electrician or with radio service man depending on which is the most available. Now they keep working on these varies phases and these are master control boxes. • Nichols: We are certainly getting some complex answers to a very simple question. Aiassa: Well, I want to say this. Its a complicated operation and its not simple t,o answer. Young: I notice here that you have cut 3 courses here 3 educational program and they might be quite valuable. Aiassa: Normally we would probably put that under the personnel budget and also I want to say to is that some of these courses are rather elaborate courses and there would be no point to send a maintenance electrian or someone, unless he is going to come back with something worth while for the city. Young: rendered at lesser cost. Aiassa: I assume some one asked for it, its in this department. And asked for it in better faith that better service can be We always give them a 50-50 try its whether the budget can bear it or not. Which comes first the meat or potatoes. Eliot: We have consistent problem of deleating educational coursed and replacing in the personnel budget in the since that all in-house training should be channeled threw the personnel department. So therefore in this particular budget and others under educational where courses have requested they have not been so much refused as being deleated from here and then the department being told channel threw the personnel department who then can handle all the request. So this is not turned down in that since. Aiassa: We also sometimes can't spare the individual if it is a one man spot. Young: Alright, is there anything further on traffic engineering, Mr. Shearer? Shearer: The signals are maintained jointly. Aiassa: Yes, you're right. It is actually 3 people. Shearer: I also would like to know how many soley maintained signals we have. • Aiassa: That I requested my self so you'll have that available. Young: Alright, anything further on traffic:, signals? Aiassa: Mr. Zimmerman informed me that we have 35. Then we have others that are joint between state. 1:�3 Young: I suggest we adjourn for 45 minutes. We will reconven at 6:45. Is that agreeable. Young: 822 is up I believe. Aiassa: 822 is traffic maintenance. • Eliot: I think Councilmen -,Nichols asked what the big change was in 21 and that is an item $7500 for changing all of our speed limits signs to comply with the new state law requirements. I believe this new international, instead of black on white is going to be white on black. I believe. Lloyd: Aren't the signs changing with these new signs? Eliot: All new international standards. Aiassa: We will maintain the same shields but we will use volcanizer and its a skin thats put on over the other ones. So we re -use which is the most expensive the steel sign it self. Chappell: I see some of the school signs up there pretty good ones. Aiassa: Also the bicycle route is up. Nichols: Whats the difference that $7500 but there is 1200 differencial there. • Aiassa: Do you know how many signs we have? Nichols: I asked what the difference was and he said there was a $7500 item for sings and I said thats only part whats the difference. Eliot: The rest of it is in the sign material. For up -dating our sign blanks for again,` the same purpose it is the I believe an effort to internationalize all traffic signals and the scotch -light material is for altering certain other signs that we have in the city. There is a dead line I am not aware at the moment what the dead line is. Chappell: Did we get any special funds for this? Aiassa: No, actually what they are trying to do is make it national so that everything would be uniform and also it is required that we paint instead where we have the yellow line we have another color combination and I held off that this year because it was quite a re -paint job so we will wait until we have to re -paint. Aiassa: This is not by our makings or doings. • Chappell: There complusary things without any help are costly aren't they. Aiassa: I wish we could do it under the basis that we only replace an the necessity and the requirements, require but we have vandelism on these signs and somebody just works for certain candidates like to stick those cuey ones on especially our stop sig:s. One of the items to thats rather expensive to is our street especially our secondary streets requires new paint annually. Young: Anything further on street maintenance. Aiassa: Lloyd: • Eliot: in the retirement program. Lloyd: Eliot: another year because it Chappell: 832-the only change is the contractual area. The other ones are the full time positions. How many more years does Mr. Stanford have to go? I believe he is intending to retire the latter part of this year. He is waiting to see if there will be any liberation Is he eligible for the CHP because of his involvement in the Police department. He may be because of his part tame work as a police officer, yes. If the police department were to get it he might wait doesn't become mandatory unitl July 1, 1973, I believe. Actually we only have 1 person on here now a 2 a person. Eliot: Right. Next account would be 841 which is street lighting. This is the city wide lighting assesment district. Primary purpose of course is to install lighting standards where there are none and to pay for energy. In the current year we are not intending to install any new electrical lears. The entire sum reflected here is for energy except for the small amount for the engineering staff time spent on the district. 841 as I say covers the entire city and when you come to 842 that is the small •additional district formed when we annexed the Villas. This required by law that we form a separate district for a new annexation, after a period of time they have a new common experation time we will re -combine to one large assesment. Young: On item 37 is that a mistake? Equipment operating should that be 6 thousand on the budget worksheet B It is 6 thousand on object worksheet...... E1 iot Young: It looks as if it should be 3 thousand because the..... Its 3 thousand on budget worksheet but its 6 thousand everywhere else. Eliot: I'll have to double check it but it would appear from the addition just glancing at it that the total went down by 3 thousand that that was intended to reduce from 6 thousand to 3 thousand since the total reduced 3 thousand. I would suppose 3 thousand was correct. 842 would be the smaller district again providing lighting energy in the Villas. Young: 40 Adjourned to June 8th.