03-01-1971 - Regular Meeting - MinutesCh °N�'�,�p
MINUTES OF THE ADJOURNED MEETING OF THE CITY COUNCIL oats' of
AND co,'>
HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION °jr� ecii nd'.
CITY OF WEST COVINA, CALIFORNIA
MARCH 1, 1971.
The joint adjourned meeting of the City Council and the
Human Relations Commission called to order at 7:32 P.M.
by Mayor Ken Chappell in the West Covina Council Chambers.
The Pledge of Allegiance was led by the Mayor.
ROLL CALL
Present: Mayor Chappell; Councilmen Shearer, Nichols,
Young, Lloyd
Chairman Teall; Commissioners Beem, Cano,
averholt
Absent: Commissioner Smith
Others Present: George Aiassa, City Manager
H. R. Fast, Public Services Director -
Richard Munsell, Planning Director
Lela Preston, City Clerk
Terry Brandt, Administrative Analyst
Ross Nammar, Administrative Assistant
Mayor Chappell stated due to the lack of outside attendance at
the meeting, it would convene to the City Manager's conference
room, where a more informal atmosphere would prevail.
Meeting reconvened at 7:40 P.M.
DISCUSSION ITEMS:
• 1. DISCRIMINATORY PRACTICES OF LOCAL
APARTMENT HOUSE OWNERS/MANAGERS
Chairman Teall: We asked for a meeting for two reasons:
One, we have a lot of new people on the
Commission including myself, I have been
on just a little over a year and we thought it would be a good
time to get together, to know each other a little better, maybe
exchange ideas and philos.o�)hiss and also to discuss the items we
have on our agenda. The proposed agenda includes some of the
items we are attempting to accomplish in 1971. I think it is
important, as a Commission, to do something. To have some
ideas, some creativity, if you will.
Mayor Chappell: Fine. Mr. Aiassa before getting into
the discussion do you have anything you
want to say? (Answered "no".)
Chairman Teall do you want to start the discussion then?
Chairman Teall: On the 17th of December a Mrs. Coffin,
a member of the Fair Housing Commission
in West Covina, appeared before the
Commission at our request and discussed the fact that in almost
every instant with the possible exception of four, there is
definite discrimination being practiced by apartment house
owners in the City of West Covina. They ran tests by sending
in black families, well dressed, well educated, asking for
an apartment and finding nothing and five minutes later sendng
in white people, poorly dressed, and they were able to rent an
apartment. Mrs. Coffin came to us at our request because she
felt that we, as the Human Relations Commission or the City of
West Covina, we could do nothing about it. They were attempting
to have Federal action against these apartment house owners and
- 1 -
It
•
M
JOINT MEETING 3/1/71 Page Two
CITY COUNCIL & HUMAN REL. COM.
we feel there might be a better way, or quieter way to handle
this situation if there is discrimination. We thought of
sending invitations to the apartment house owners/managers
to meet with us and discuss with us their problems and
invite the people that conducted the survey and also those
discriminated against and maybe by dialogue eliminate the
problems without going to court and giving West Covina the
publicity that it does not deserve. There are apartment
house owners/managers who do not practice discrimination in
this City and this is our objective to let these people know
that we are aware they do not and congratulate them either
by letter or commendation of some sort. I think this is one
of the most important problems we have at the present time.
We would like to have your comments or thoughts on this item.
Mayor Chappell_: _
do any surveying o
My only question. This information that
came from this one lady -had you had this
information given to you before or did you
n your own?
Chairman Teall: No. Mr. Smith did quite a bit of personal
checking.on this and unfortunately he is
sick tonight and he is the one that stated
there is locally, discrimination. We have not done any work
on our own as far as going out and checking it.
Commissioner Beem: We did a few years ago. We sent out
questionnaires to apartment house owners/
managers and also at one time we had a
woman Chairman of the Commission and she went out from door to
door and was quite startled to find that this was so. We got
very few answers to our questionnaire. It was a simple form
and required no signature. We sent it to all the apartments
in the City and received probably 6 to 8 replies. At that
timelgoing door to door they were trying to find a home or
apartment for a professional negro that was to be moved into
the area and work here, but they had -no success. However we
found through that endeavor that there were 3 or 4 apartment
houses in West Covina that had no qualms about it and did
rent to minorities.
Councilman Young: If discrimination can be proved the party
discriminated against has a civil remedy
against the apartment house owner. I
think that is the status of the law. Maybe you can tell me
if there is a criminal sanction for discriminatory practice
or some kind of sanction that does not involve the person
being discriminated against other than the party being a
witness as a party to the action?
Commissioner Cano: There is none.
Councilman Young:' The problem is the party who is discriminated
against comes in my office and says these
people won't rent to me because I am a negro
and so you sue them for me, and well I don't want to bother with
it - it takes time and money, and I think most lawyers feel that
way, because usually he doesn't have the fee and you are in a
nebulous area, one difficult to prove. You have to have all
kinds of witnesses to establish your case and it is not really
an effective remedy and it costs a lot of money. I think some
consideration might be given to that in the terms of making it
a little easier.
Commissioner Cano: Today I was asked by a group of people
doing a project research for the University
of California Medical Center, I was asked
- 2 -
JOINT MEETING 3/1/71
CITY COUNCIL & HUMAN REL. COM.
Page Three
to help them formulate a questionnaire going to all the
physicians in the areas of Mexican -American population,
and they asked me how do you think we should state the
question,and I asked them what do you want to know and they
said)in essence,we want to know if these physicians are pro-
viding services to Mexican -Americans and the minorities? And
it.seemed something like the letter that might have gone out
before by the Commission. I told them you know if you ask the
physician do you provide service - can you imagine one that
will answer "No"? I said try going to the consumer and asking
who has provided the service and then go to him and ask
questions,because you know in fact he does. I think if we
went to the owners/managers and asked do you discriminate?
Obviously they are going to say "no" or not read it and if in
fact they do,I doubt they would return the questionnaire. So
the next step is legal action. The reason we are here tonight
is before that legal action takes place by that explosion of
emotional reaction, the quagmire of judicial procedure begins, -
we were hoping there might be a possibility of our collectively
assuming the form of a catalyst and developing some kind of a
humanistic approach to these people who have the job of
reflecting the owner, although they may not feel that way.
But the owner says these are my rules and they have to reflect
that way, or the owner says use your own initiative and they
reflect their own feelings. The question is - what procedures,
what things can we do collectively as a Commission? .We have
our ideas and our idea first of all is to try and communicate.
I am not asking if you have ideas to give to .us but what do
you think of the idea of communication? After communication,
determination, and after determination then legality.
Councilman Lloyd: Mr. Mayor. I think one of the things we
are faced with here first of all, and I am
speaking for myself as a Councilman, I
expect this Commission to act and react to those who come in
contact with it, in both a civilized and intelligent manner,
accepting the fact that there is indeed discrimination and
accepting the fact that we do not possess the remedies for the
true solution simply because we cannot legislate human emotion.
If we accept that then I think we will have the basis for some
positive action. I want you people to move in the aerna that
we are discussing. I am of the opinion that this City and
every City around us, is going to face some very traumatic
situations until man has accepted that a man should be judged
on the basis of his qualifications and not on the overall
variables of which he may have no control. So as a result I
think when you say what should be our reaction, I am of the
opinion speaking as a person who believes very strongly in
the court system and I don't think it will fall apart tomorrow
as predicted, it is important that court cases be evolved, we
have to have this as the basis for decisions to come forward
as far as all cities are concerned. I think we should at
least be openminded and willing to discuss the problems as
they arise in our community/but for Mrs. Coffin to tell me
there is discrimination in West Covina, the answer is - Yes
I know, and not,so what - but what do you propose - really is
• what comes forward. I don't have to have proof positive.
There is no great revelation in that. There is discrimination
in West Covina, discrimination in Covina, in San Dimas and
LaVerne, etc. etc. There is no question about that. To give
you a specific - LaVerne has a fairly heavy Mexican -American
population and as a result they have some problems and they
really didn't know they had any problems until we had this
upheaval of civil rights. With the advent of reapportionment
you are going to see this focused,.not on us per se, but we have
- 3 -
JOINT MLFTING 3/l/71 Page Four
CITY COUNCIL & HUMAN REL. COM.
to be mindful of the problems and I think that is exactly what
this Commission should do. You are not going to find all the
solutions. I know Mrs. Coffin personally and her husband,
who is a teacher at Covina High School and I recognize the
impluse and drive these people have and I also know that
drive and those attitudes which they embrace, espouse and
practice, are simply not the total attitudes that are
embraced and practiced by the average homeowner in West Covina,
much less the apartment owner/manager. My point as a
Councilman is that is what you people are going to have to
bravely face and make recommendations to this very august body.
Commissioner Overholt: In the past several years we have
established rapport with the real estate
profession and I think we have done a
fairly good job in convincing them of the value of dispersal
of minority groups throughout the area. They were somewhat
reticent to accept this when we first started our meetings, but
as time went on we had much more luck in the meeting of minds
with the real estate profession. But in apartment house owners/
managers it is very frustrating in that you are dealing with
either an absentee owner who sets the policy, or if the owner
is here he says that the manager sets the policy and you get a
cross rough going and it is really impossible to put your
finger on who is responsible for any discriminatory practice
and it is very frustrating to deal with.
Chairman Teall: I agree Councilman Lloyd, that this is what
we have the courts for but unfortunately the
courts are so backed up right now that it
will take months, even years to have them get around to the
• specific case. I feel by a good merchandising program to the
apartment house owners/managers with the specific facts from
those apartment house owners who do not discriminate.and they
are working to full capacity, they have waiting lists, etc.
My own feeling is that the great majority of discrimination by
apartment house owners is merely the dollar. The fear of the
loss of the dollar revenue. So if we can talk to these people
in friendly dialogue and lay out the facts and discuss it in
a friendly atmosphere, I think this is our main purpose rather
than waiting until the courts get around to it because this
thing would be building and building. Right now we don't
have a fantastically serious discrimination problem in West
Covina although we have a problem.
Councilman Lloyd: Do you find that discrimination is against
the oriental or other ethnic groups, or
mainly blacks?
Chairman Teall: I would guess primarily black in the apart-
ment house set up.
Commissioner Beem: As I think it is everywhere else.
Chairman Teall: Oriental, to my knowledge, is no great
problem in West Covina, although I heard
some interesting figures that they are
probably one of the largest minority groups in West Covina.
Councilman Young: I don't think we have particularly different
philoso.6hies.I think what Mr. Lloyd is saying
in a sense is what I am thinking. I think
it is fine to have a series of these meetings andlay these
things out in the open, but implicitly in arriving at results
somewhere down the line you have to show some muscle and there
- 4-
JOINT MEETING 3/1/71 Page Five
CITY COUNCIL & HUMAN REL. COM.
are two ways of doing this. One, through the courts and
two, through publicity. The publicity is' probably more
available to this Commission than the courts, because that
is up to the individual and you don't have, the funds to go
out and engage legal counsel and you are not the ACLU -
in other words. Nonetheless, this is where the muscle is.
You have the.ability to bring some pressure and certainly
pressure from the press. If this lady has this information
available I would think in terms of perhaps at some point
down the line if you don't see things moving in the proper
direction, lay it on the line - names, places, dates, etc.,
that is muscle. I think your idea is fine. It is a beginning
point, but you may have to back it up.
Mayor Chappell: One thing in inviting the apartment house
owners to the meetings, just inviting them
all would be a waste of time, but if you
can invite just a few that.you know discriminate and then
bring in one apartment house owner/manager that has rented to
minorities and has had no problems to talk to these other
people and let them know that perhaps their feelings are un-
founded. Because let's face it, this person may or may not
own the apartment but he has 50 units there and 35 units here
and has to meet X mortgage payments and eat and he feels when
lie rents to a minority he is going to lose two or three or
four of his regular tenants and he is real concerned about
this. So if you have an owner that can say we rented to some
really fine minority families and they are a credit to our
apartment and the neighbors have no objection to them - this
might help. You are not going to break thi"s down overnight,
or even if you went through the courts could you do it over-
night because you would have to blast each one individually.
• It would take.years. This other approach we haven't tried it
so we don't know whether it will work or_not, but it might be
a way to go.
Councilman Young: There have been a few court cases. Nobody
likes to get sued because they have to hire
lawyers and spend a lot of dough and time.
Councilman Shearer: And a suit of this kind does have to
come from an individual I hope we
are not talking about the City of West
Covina suing! So in reality aren't the items that the
Commission has indicated about all we can do as a City? Try
to get a meeting of the minds, to communicate, to bring
publicity, positive or negative, depending on the individual.
I feel the things suggested are all that we can do and that
we should encourage the Commission along this line.
Chairman Teall: I feel encouraged. I like the idea of
Councilman Young - in terms of the adverse
publicity, where the person literally thumbs
his nose in spite of the fact there is proof that he has
practiced discrimination in renting his apartments. This idea
of bringing in several�or three to one)also is very good
because we could -do this on a personal invitation basis
rather than by letter.
Commissioner Cano: Part of the problem we saw was develop-
ing some kind of an alliance with the
new apartment house builders in the City.
Some of the ideas that we have are to develop a feeling of
alliance rather than antagonism after the fact. I think this
is one of the keys to developing that affirmative action
philosophy before the fact rather than having to deal with
- 5 -
JOINT MELTING 3/1/71
CITY COUNCIL & HUMAN REL. COM.
problems after.
Page Six
Commissioner Beem: I think the major problem is a lack
of publicity in letting the people
know there is a Commission established
in the City and that they can at least write in and come befoxe
us with their_ grievances. We can only arbitrate, we cannot
make positive decisions, which I personally wouldn't want to do.
I feel through the Unruh Housing Act it is possible to use that
in bringing a case to court, but that involves a great deal of
time and waiting until it comes up and who has the money or the
time? And so to stop that from happening because the publicity
alone would probably be the worst thing the City could get
into, I would suggest that we try and get an advertising
campaign started to let people know we are here, that we have
an open housing practice in the City and if we could get back
on the air with the local radio station�I feel it would help.
I thought what we did previously in that line was very good.
We had a discussion with the Police Department, and a couple
of times a realtor appeared - I don't know how many people
really heard it, but I had some favorable comments on it.
The apartment house owners, those that
do have their life savings in this, I would sympathize with
them a great deal in who I would want to rent to because of the
financial problems involved because of the theory that the
property would drop in value or other tenants would move out.
So the theory is what we have to work on with the apartment
house owners. The suggestion of inviting a small group with
one that does not discriminate,I think is good and we can get
to them better that way and also give them a firm example of
someone that does rent to minority people. The part that I
feel is not going to work is because we did this in the past
with a questionnaire and received very little results. That
is why I brought up the matter of publicity because I feel
if we could incorporate some type of publicity previous to
inviting them in we might have a better chance of getting them
to come and discuss.
Chairman Teall: This might very well tie in with the fourth
item on the agenda - that of the Housing
Opportunities Week which is to be April 19th
through the 25th.
Mayor Chappell: It is possible that things will change in
the apartment house picture. The past
three or four years that I have been aware
of this situation we have really had a full house type situation
in West Covina. I don't think anyone can argue that. There
just basically are no vacancies. Here they said six vacancies
in one apartment building and I would question that because
we haven't had that type of vacancy. We now have a number of
large apartments being constructed and if that alleviates the
situation there might be vacancies, two or three vacancies
up and down the street and it might then help this idea work.
But I know in my work in talking to apartment house owners
they do not have vacancies, if they have one and they don't
have a waiting list they put a sign up and that afternoon the
place is rented again. If I was one of them and I appeared
before the Commission I would say - "hey, fine, I am not
fighting you at all but I have a no vacancy factor" and you go
there and you can't dispute it, he doesn't have. But now we
are building quite a number of apartments - Mr. Munsell how
many?
Mr. Munsell: We have 460 nearing completion and another
404 which we will start breaking ground
- 6 -
JOINT MELTING 3/1/71 Page Seven
CITY COUNCIL & HUMAN REL. COM.
very shortly, not counting the 4-plexes.
Councilman Nichols: That is about 20% of the total apartments
now in West Covina.
Councilman Shearer: And how many on Barranca and Virginia?
ML. Munsell. Another 300.
Mayor Chappell: So there is'at least 20/ of our total amount
of apartments now in West Covina, are being
constructed so this might change the whole
picture.
Commissioner Cano: Are you saying then because we have the
apartments continually being rented that
there is no reason for these people to take
a chance in renting to minorities?
Mayor Chappell: I just explained how I thought you might
approach it - by inviting three or four
and having one that does rent to minorities
show them how it does work.
Commissioner Cano: Your point is a good one and in fact if I
were an apartment house owner and I had
no reason to take a chance that I might
drive out some of my tenants and if I did have that idea that
by renting to a minority that my tenants would leave, I think
that point is probably well taken and that they will not take
that chance. But at one time or another there has to be a
vacancy and at that time I think there is the chance for that
• education that you speak of taking place.
Mayor Chappell: We all ]snow there is no easy answer to this.
Let's be realistic about this. The guy that
has a 4 unit apartment and he has to keep
three of them rented just to pay his payments - well they are
apprehensive and have any of you seen some of the forms that
have to be filled out to become eligible to rent apartments
in our City? They look like they are really looking for
cream puffs and they may get 15 to 20 applications and when
they get one that looks like a cream puff that is actually who
they rent too. I have seen some of these forms and I don't
know if we could all become eligible according to some of the
questions they ask regarding income, tenure of service, etc.
These are problems that are realistic and if you have a small
apartment you live with these things everyday. Basically,
West Covina house_wise is better off today then when I moved
.to West Covina. I see no real big hardship in renting a
house and I think it was partly due to the hard work and
determination on the part of the Commission. Two of you are
here who were on the Commission originally and you know what
I am talking about. I think the same hard work is going to
have to be done on the apartment house problem.
is very
Nichols: I am an apartment house owner in a
very small way. I am trying to buy a
four-plex in Covina and even the
fact of somebody vacating, moving out before I would like them
to go, costs me money and the fact the apartment goes vacant
for even 2 weeks and I have to go in and spend a whole weekend
decorating and it costs me money and emotional trauma, and if
I had a vacancy and a black person came to my apartment tomorrow
I think probably I would not rent for the fact I would figure
I would have one or two others moving out. Because in that
small setting of three or four units there is a personal-
- 7 -
JOINT MEETING 3/1/71 Page Eight
C1"'1'Y COUNCIL, & HUMAN RI,.L. COM.
interchange, a sensitivity much greater than exists in the large
complexes and I have to,as a small investor, rent at all times
three of my four apartments to make my monthly payments on the
property and I don't feel charitable enough to want to take the
risk of excessive vacancies to pioneer in a racial area. Now why
do I say what I say? Because that is exactly the way I feel and
that is exactly the way 99 out of 100 small apartment operators
are going to feel. And there is no manner or. way you can change
that because it is their elbow grease that is involved, it is
not yours, it is their money that is involved, it is not yours,
it is their loss that is involved, not yours, and they are not
going to change. And they may state the same as I do and say,
well in a sense of the ethical manner it is discriminatory,
but you know you still have to make the payments and you still
have to go work on the weekends. So where is the access to the
change in this climate in our community? It is not to the
Mom and Pop operat=s,.who have 3, 4, 5, 6, or 8 units in
West Covina, because they cannot block broad currents, the
answer is to the huge developments. Where there are going
to be 400 to 800 units going in. If our Human Relations
Commission can get a commitment from them to rent without dis-
crimination then there will be no black man or any other man
that wants to move into the City that will be discriminated
against. If you can go to the 116 units next to West Covina
High School and get them to say - yes we will rent to anybody you will break the barriers of discrimination,and within .
three or four years and then the little Mom and Pop operators
will have no fear anymore because it will be commonly done
in the community and the lead will have been established by
tho,�:ebig operators that are truly commercial ventures. So in
my judgment the approach that our Commission can use will be
to work with the major renting agencies and you will find
if you will look at the records right now that by and large
• it is the big apartments that rent to minority people.
The Mom and Pop operators, they feel a threat to their
economic life and they are not going to pioneer on the basis
of that threat against them. I think a wonderful opportunity
exists for the Commission right now in the terms of these
majoi: developments that are getting underway.
Commissioner Ca.no: I think one of the assumptions that
you made is probably the reason that
most of the people do not rent to
minorities and I say assumption because it has been proven
many times over again that when in fact a minority does move
in, depending on the type of people that can move into these
Mom and Pop type apartment houses, that it is the rare
exceptions where a person actually moves out because of the
minority person moving in. Your feelings are rather
emotional and you do have that feeling that if,in fact you do
have to take that loss that you are not prepared for it and
you go from that point in fact, when in fact there is a
foundation that you should be building to either have or not
have the premise that you have.
Councilman Nichols: That is obviously true and I over -
dramatized my own personal feelings
for the effects this evening as a
small apartment house owner. The shortage of apartments is
not as great as Mayor Ken would have you believe, in fact a
good qualified tenant can find a very adequate rental in a
couple of places in West Covina right now. For instance the
new apartment complex that is built in behind West Covina
High School, that was completed and open for occupancy last
July and is not full yet. There are about 95 out of 116
apartments that are now rented. There are about 21 or 22
vacant apartments if you want to pay $160. for a one bedroom
and $180. for a two bedroom unit. You can go down on Bandy
- 8 -
JOINT MLL;TINC 3/1/71 ]'age Nine
CITY COUNCIL & HUMAN REED. COM.
and Pima tonight and rent yourself a nice two bedroom apartment.
There are four vacancy signs on Bandy and Pima this evening.
IIow do I know - because I am in the rental business and I check
these things out every week, because it is a competitive
business. Now as long as you have a neighborhood where there
are no minority people in existence living, for instance the
place where I own my little 4-plex, way up on Hirsch Street
in Covina, north of San Bernardino Road, there is one block
of nothing but 4-plexes and I don't think, there is a black
family on that whole block'. I think there is a probability
that the vast majority of the managers and owners would conclude
that they are going to lose tenants to somebody else if they
rent to a black person. Now this may be totally fear, but
it is their money that is going to be lost if they are right
and not your s. So to convince them to take that step - well
if you can indemnify them, say well you know we will pay you
an indemnity if you -lose money - well then maybe you could get
the landlord to take that risk, but he is not going to run any
risk that he doesn't have too. That's the element.
Commissioner Cano: I wasn't addressing myself to the
foundation that you laid your theories
on, although I agree with your
philosophy of starting somewhere and it looks like the practical
place would be the large impersonal type that wants to make
money and if in fact he had experience in the past of renting
to minorities and still maintained a high level, we 'could go
in that direction with these large apartment owners. But I
just wanted to go on record that really the basic premise you
espoused is incorrect because it has been proven over and over
again that it really is incorrect.
Councilman Nichols: Right - the world functions on incorrect
. premises. Let me say one more thing.
I have equities in a number of single
family houses in West Covina. I have equities in some units
and when I have a vacancy, unless it is snapped up beforehand,
I advertise it openly in the press by address and location and
I have never had a minority person request one of my
vacancies yet. Never yet. If I would I would. rent to them
tomorrow personally,. but what I am trying to say to this group
is that in fact this is the way the little landlord feels.
Whether he is right or wrong he does feel that way and we will
never make inroads in this area by starting with the little
guy. We must start on the broad area. I am firmly convinced
that is correct and if we hope to make inroads as a Commission
we must begin with the major operators who can have an impact
in this area.
Commissioner Beem: I might add to this, Mr. Mayor. At the
moment we have never had a minority
person or group come before us, since
the Commission has been in existence, protesting that they
cannot get into a home or an apartment. We have had rumors,
we have had other people come and say they went with them
and had this happen, but we, in this Commission and it is our
perogative you might say, to have them write a letter -to us
and then come in and we use this procedure and so far we
haven't had any 'one. The hearsay and rumors that we hear and
take for fact, are from people such as Mrs. Coffin, who no
doubt has been involved in this for years and I don't doubt
she knows what she is talking about, but I don't think it is
so large and such an emergency that we have anything that we
can or should push in order to find a home or apartment for a
minority group because we haven't had them come before us.
I am not against it but it just hasn't happened -through the
channels.
- 9 -
JOINT MIEI TING 3/1/71
CITY COUNCIL & HUMAN RIEL. COM.
Page Ten
Councilman Young: The thrust of the law is not to the Mom and
Pop establishment that Councilman Nichols
talks about, I think it is aimed at the
larger units, nothing below -1 believe 5 units.
Chairman Teall: I really hadn't thought about the
Mom and Pop units. I think in
discussing this we thought about the
large apartments. I certainly wouldn't be interested in
having three Mom and Pop apartment owners come before us - I
would feel like the Internal Revenue Service that picks on a
guy that makes $6,000 a year because he is easy to clobber.
This is not our function but to talk to the large owners,
the ones with 100, 150, 200 units. Beautiful. If we can
accomplish our mission then automatically the Mom and Pop
units will follow.' -It is the exposure of the ethnic groups
that creates the lack of prejudice in a community.
Councilman Nichols: In reality the only man that can really
fault the little landlord that doesn't
rent to anyone based on race, creed and
color, the only man that could truly fault him is the man that
has similar units, similar commitments of his life savings and
does rent to all minority groups. The man who has no such
commitment of his life's investment is in no position to fault
anyone else. So let's no one of us be so noble that we can
fault the little guy that lives over on Bandy and has 8 units
and hasn't yet integrated - the little old lady out there
in the early morning sweeping her sidewalk - it may be all
they have to their name. Morally they are wrong, but I can
sympathize with them.
. Commissioner Overholt: Yes, but that little old lady in effect
may be accepting federally subsidized
financing..
Councilman Nichols: She likely does and,as I say, she is
wrong, just as wrong as she can be, but
in terms of having the compassion to
understand why she feels the way she does I can understand it
very readily.
Mayor Chappell: I believe we basically have a good idea on
how we all feel on this particular subject,
get started on it as soon as you can! We might now go on to
Item 2.
2. I-RJMAN RELATIONS WEEK IN WEST COVINA
Chairman Teall:
We felt this is a way we can dramatize the
fact that we are an active Commission and
-request of Council to set up sometime in
the Fall a week
devoted to this subject - a week with a
seminar on human
relations, bringing in speakers to talk on
this subject.
We are asking for: 1 - your appioval, and 2 -
for a budget of
approximately $150.00.
Mayoj.-
Chappell:
Mr. Aiassa they are now requesting a budget
will you make a note of it so we can dis-
cuss this at our budget sessions?
Mr. Aiassa:
Yes. I believe we had an appropriation set
up for miscellaneous things ....
- 10 -
JOI.tQ*T .KF,.: TING 3/1/71. Page Eleven
CITY COUNCIL & ITUMAN Rl?L,. COM.
Chairman Teall: I understand we had a $250.00 budget and
only spent $27.00 of it.
Mr. Aiassa: Before making an appropriation the Commission
should advise the Council of the exact amount
you will be spending.
Is Chairman Teall: Right. Commissioner Cano said he will take
the Co -chairmanship of this week.
Commissioner Smith is the Chairman.
Councilman Young: We have a thing going at our church now,
it is called a forum. I happen to be
presenting a series right now. We are always
looking for people to be a part of the forum.
Commissioner Cano: Actually Mr. Smith brought us a tentative
program that has been worked on by the
Los Anqeles County Human Relations
Commission and they have some very good suggestions. Again,
hopefully, we can make West Covina a model to be followed by
other small cities.
3. LETTERS AND/OR AWARDS OF COMMENDATION FOR
CONTRIBUTIONS TO HUMA'D' RELATIONS
Chairman Teall: This item covers our idea of giving awards
and letters of commendation to those people
who most actively improve human relations
in the community. Our first letter unanimously was approved
to go to Chief Sill before March 21st, since he is running a
week's session for -the Police Department in the area of
human relations, which we feel is something a little above and
beyond the call of duty. The annual awards theme will not
involve a lot of money other than possibly about $40.00 at the
end of each year for trophy awards. We feel this performs a
two -fold purpose. Number 1, it lets people know we have an
active Human Relations Commission and also it lets people know
we are aware of what is happening and what they are doing.
Councilman Nichols: You know I thought of something when
you were discussing this at your last
meeting. You could have a procedure
whereby everybody that has received a letter of commendation
from the Commission as a result of a majority vote of the
Commission du-ing the year would be eligible for consideration
by the Commission for the major award at a certain stipulated
time during the year. This would automatically create your
nominees without anymore difficult basis of considering these
people and then you could take one or two recognized by your
letters earlier as being your major recipient for the year.
It might be a very effective tradition to get underway.
Commissioner Cano: I think it is an excellent idea.
Mayor Chappell: I think. this Council has shown that they
think awards and thank you letters are
very worthwhile. People receiving a letter
or perma plaque, it really means more to them than if you had
paid them for theii work.. I am certainly in favor of this
type of thing. We all like -to get this type of award and it is
important to us. Speaking for myself, I am very happy to
see you take something like this on because it has a lot of
merit: and it may stimulate that little extra effort down the
Line to get an award _like this.
0
JOINT MEETING 3/1/71 :page Twelve
CITY COUNCIL & HUMAN RL;:L . COM .
Commissioner Overholt: Could we ask that you, on the Council,
also consider candidates and let us
know of anyone you might- thin;c deserving?
Mr. Aiassa: Also the schools should not be overlooked.
They are actively participating in this type
of program.
Mayor Chappell: Yes students are working in this area and
you will have to let -them know that it is
available. Teachers will be writing names to
you.
Mr. Aiassa: I think the Tribune will give you a news re-
lease when you are ready to launch this.
Councilman Young: Also the intermediate schools work in this
area. I have spoken to several of them at
Hollencrest and it is something the teachers
have to fight to keep it going.
Chairman Teall: Fred Shrader called me today and asked if we
could have people from the Human Relations
Commission come in and talk to his classes
and I told him we would.
Councilman Young: Also Bemoll's school has a program with his
teachers, they were at a Council meeting
recently with a group of students. .
Chairman Teall: We are happy to make ourselves available as
our calendar will permit. We had a discussion
at Edgewood High - three of us - Mr. Martz's
class and we all enjoyed it very much.
Commissioner Cano: Our chairman said.the crowning compliment was
when a young gentleman came up to us after
class and said "you guys are cool."
One of the comments I wanted to make before getting off this
subject, we had in mind not one award but hopefully one award in
each area: housing, communications, education, etc., a number of
areas and making this award quite an emotional type of thing
and build publicity using this philosophy.
Councilman Young: Any potential of tying in with West Covina
Beautiful and the Birthday Ball?
Commissioner Cano: It is in the formative stages at present.
Councilman Young: I just thought I would throw it out, I
like to see inter -relationships.
Councilman Lloyd: The idea is not fundamentally unsound.
West Covina Beautiful and having a beautiful
community involves human relations and
certainly after the last West Covina Ball anything that would
excite people should not be overlooked.
4. HOUSING OPPORTUNITIES WEEI{
Chairman Teall: This is a statewide week that runs April 19
through the 25th and we would like -to have
the Council declare that week as Fair
Housing Opportunities Weep: in the City of
West Covina.
Counciaman 1:,1-oyd: Do you want a motion on that, Mr. Mayor?
- 12 -
JO:I:NT MF: TING 3/1/71 Page Thirteen
CITY COUNCIL & I-MMAN REL. COM.
Mayor Chappell: We probably should do so at a regular meeting
so that perhaps a little publicity will rub
off. Mr. Aiassa, will you put it on the
agenda of the city council?
Is Chairman Teall:
5. DEMOGRAPHIC MAP
I assume you have the information
a copy of the proposed resolution.
(Mr. Aiassa said it would be taken
on it and
care of.)
Commissioner Cano: With regard to the demographic map, we
don't think it is going to be necessary
for any expenditures on the part of the
City. In fact we- are sure there will be none needed for staff.
What we see happening is with the help of the L.A. County Human
Relations Commission developing the kind of data they will get
us the material to put this map together. This material has
been developed in the past by the County and it is legal and
it is being done and we think we can do it quickly and more
effectively with their help. If there is no comment on that
then I would like to go into why the map and give my
explanation.
The map is to be used Solely as a tool to
develop ideas on the trends that are taking place within West
Covina. Mr. Aiassa and I spoke at length this morning and
he brought up some very good points that this map in the hands
of unscrupulous people could be used for a number of negative
reasons. I think that even if it is used by real estate people,
for instance, as Mr. Aiassa stated, to develop whatever block
• busting or whatever actions talke place, it will show actually
what is happening on the map itself the following year and this
can give us even more hard data to be able to go back to the
-real estate people and others using it for negative purposes
and hopefully develop even a stronger tool to work against
that negative philosophy.
Councilman Shearer: With the assurance that the expenditure
of the City is at best minimal, I would
withdraw my objection that I had
originally. I am not sure it will get the benefits expected
but if the cost is minimal I will not object. The thing that
concerns me on something like this is" the constant change.
It is fine, you make a survey and I am not sure how the"data
is gathered, but the first thought I had was that it was
something staff would have to obtain. It is one thing to
obtain the data and another thing to keep it updated,
because people are moving in and out constantly and when we
pinpoint actual addresses, I wondered how are we going to
keep making changes from month to month, as the changes took
place in the City and are we talking about an accurate map?
But if the data is going to be supplied and the cost is.
minimal, who am I to say that this should be denied.
Mr'. Aiassa: I had suggested to Mr. Cano this morning
if the County can provide this statistical
data I would like to see one of the cities
that this has been compil.ed for by them. The thing I am
concerned with is once it leaves this Board and goes to Council
it is a public record and anyone is entitled to have it. It
will also provide the exposure of areas that probably need
exposing to prevent them from going into block busting
programs, for example the areas of Broadmoor and P'rancisquito
also P'rancisqui.to and Azusa - which we know as the areas that
have been pretty well brought together. But there will be an
expense in order to 1�'Ieep it accurate and we all know :in order
JOINT MEETING 3/1/71
CITY COUNCIL & FIUMAN FZL,:I:.,. COM.
Page fourteen
to be of use it will need constant input either through
property exchange or some kind of service that we now have,,
called ownership exchange.
Councilman Shearer: I would suggest that Council be kept
informed of this so we know what we are
getting into.
Commissioner Overholt: We had, sometime ago, the report that
Mr. Peacock compiled and at the time
he did this - and I think also in the
last year or so we feel much less defensive about asking
these questions than we did then, it used to be not very
popular_ to ask what your ethnic background was and to look at
a person we can tell he is black, so I don't know why they
should feel defensive about the question asking where he
lives. But I do think this information, in all due respect
to your certain objections, could be very valuable because
without this data we don't know what the ethnic make up of this
community is. If we could get this information even annually it
would .help.
Mr. Aiassa: I mentioned to Mr. Cano the census
statistics will be available to us this coming
June. I am a little suspicious of the
County because I have dealt with them in certain areas and I feel
if it is going to be put out and endorsed by West Covina I want
it accurate.
.Commissioner Overholt: There is one other facet to this that
. also came out a
the City of West
they going to do
on the value of
get the reasons
editorial.
we should all be aware of. When
Mr. Peacock's report came out there
very negative editorial in the Tribune about
Covina espousing this report and what were
with it, etc. etc. I think if we can agree
the report then it would behoove us to try and
to the press before they come out with an
Councilman Lloyd: Who wrote the editorial?
Commissioner Overholt: Mr. Tracy.
Commissioner Cano: Mr. Mayor, I have two points.
Essentially when Mr. Aiassa speaks about
the correctness of the survey we should
be aware that the census regarding the Mexican -American is not
identified per se. The second point I wanted to make was that
hopefully this kind of a tool is not really going to be used
month by month. I had an idea of using it on an annual basis,
to help us develop a trend that is taking place, whether it
is people moving out of an area or concentrating in a specific
part of the area. It is a yearly tool, not one which is kept
updated by staff on a monthly basis. If in fact this
information is given to us they are going to have to have a
cut off time and we can use that point year after year.
Mayor Chappell: At best it is never going to be
accurate. Even the census - many of
those people have moved out already. 20/ of West Covina turns
over every year and certainly the minorities fit into 20/
somewhere. In the minutes I read you were looking for
accuracy, but there is just no way that can be too accurate.
- 14 -
JOINT ME l..'ING 3/1/71 Page Fifteen
CITY COUNCIL & 1-1UMAN REL. COM .
Councilman Shearer: Before you go full boar to develop
an address by address map you should
probably explore a little further as
to really what it is you want. If you are only talking about
trends there may be some way and I am not suggesting how you
can go about it, but there may be a way of developing trends
on the way of numbers. As I understand this, data was
compiled by voting precint:s so let's assume last year there
was 6/ and this year 12/ then maybe that is the precint
you would analyze further. If the ratio was still 6/ is
it really significant that they moved from Street A to
Street B within this larger area, without doing the whole
city annually, monthly or bi-annually. In other words breaking
it down and sectionizing it until you find where the problem is.
Commissioner Cano: Depending on the priorities and what
the tool is going to be used for.
Think of a pie. If we have 10 people
of a minority group per cut of the pie, that's fine, then it
is finely balanced; but if all 10 people in that cut of the
pie are in the center of the pie then that is an entirely
different picture. They are grouped in a small area and
not really e.xemplify.irjthe equal opportunity philorsophy.we..are
trying to use this tool for.
Councilman Shearer: As long as we don't have an exorbitant
expenditure I will withhold further
comment until that time.
Mayor Chappell: What minority are you identifying?
All of them?
• Commissioner Cano: Hopefully we would like to. Somehow
and somewhere we have to consider some
people that are not minorities. If we
were in the East Coast we could easily include the Italians
with the Puerto Ricans in to the minorities with some of the
other ethnic groups that are now feeling the freedom bandino
syndrome. The philosphy here is pretty clear cut. We.have a
group �)f people that are easily discernible, that is the
black, and the spanish surname - we want to get as best a map
as we can.
Mayor Chappell: This is why $5,000 was used at one time,
because to get all of this information that
you point out it would be a cost that we
would not be willing to go into.
Councilman Shearer: I certainly hope the County has a
better way of compiling this data then
the State does. When we make our
quarterly ethnic survey of employees since it is illegal to
keep this in the personnel files now, we make a quarterly
survey and letters" are sent around to people at my lever_
saying don't tell anybody but list down from personal
knowledge, and this is.how we go about making these surveys
that are illegal.
Commissioner Cano: Hopefully you are going to use many
different tools and that is one of
them and the other is the
fantastically accurate Federal census which was taken awhile
back. And it doesn't really make that much difference in a
City .Like West Covina because the Mexican -American that lives
in West Covina isn't the same as the ones living in Los Angeles,
- 15 -
JOINT MEETING 3/1/71 Page Sixteen
CITY COUNCIL & HUMAN REL. COM.
and I am sure doesn't have to worry about the immigration
authorities, but at the same time we had our census in Last
Los Angeles they were conducting the annual roundup for
illegal Mexicans and that just goes to show you the federal
bureaucracy of rounding up two things at the same time.
• They imported agents from the Canadian border to the
Mexican border and they go around and round -up as many of these
illegals as they can find and that is the time people close
their doors. There might be a family in Los Angeles with
6 or 7 members and one illegal and they just don't open the
door to anyone with a tie on, in fact the immigration people
have found this out and so now they are wearing tee shirts.
Commissioner Beem: I want to make one comment on the map.
I don't think we need it and never did
thine: we needed it. We have gone
through this twice before. The second one we had showed
disbursement from the original, which I thought was very well
done. I am opposed to this for two reasons. First of all
because we have already gone through it and saw the disburse-
ment from one time to another. I realize that we have
new Commissioners now and no doubt they would like to start it
all over again and find out what is what and why is why, and
I don't think we need it. Financially it is going to cost
us money and also we could be liable in some kind of. a libel
suit and the City could be involved because the Commission is
representing the City, and I personally don't want to be
involved in a suit. If this is going to be public knowledge,
I just want to go on record as saying I don't care if we have
it, I don't think we need it.
• Councilman Young: I don't think the comment should be
taken lightly. The question did �kind
of enter my mind when talking about
an address by address specific area size tends to over-
emphasize, in my opinion, the presence of the minority
persons at specific locations. This may be something that
should be discussed with the City Attorney.
Mr. Aiassa: We are going to have a discussion with
the City Attorney on Wednesday. I
think we ought to let Mr. Cano find
out what he can get as a sample and then we can look it over
and then decide. If he can provide the statistics then we
can come together administratively and discuss it.
Mayor Chappell: That is probably the step we should
take - if there are no objections on
that procedure? (None.)
Councilman Shearer: Mr. Mayor, I have an item that I would
like to bring up now that I think
should be looked into. I visited the
Bren Development yesterday and there is some misinformation
being given out by at least one salesman and this directly
involves the City. It is regarding who is going to pay for
the maintenance -of the sales of the open space. You recall
when the Assessment District was formed that this was one
of our concerns that the average single family would pay
something like $10.00 per month in taxes to -the Assessment
District. I wondered how this was being presented and I talk-
ed to two different salesmen yesterday. The fii:st salesman
did admit that only the people in the Bren development would
- 16 -
JOINT MI'-:ETING 3/l/71 Page Seventeen
C:C'a'Y COUNCIL & HUMAN REL. COM.
•
0
pay. The second salesman when I asked how it would be maintained
he said the City would be maintaining and when I asked liow it
would be paid he said by taxes and I said by people only in this
area or all over the City, and he said all over the City.
Which is an out and out statement. I feel by next year when
the tax bills come out we may have a few disenchanted people
appearing before Council. I would like to suggest that staff
contact the Bren people and I actually had to weed this
information out of both people.
(Mr. Aiassa said Bren would be contacted and this would be
discussed.)
ADJOURNMENT Mayor Chappell thanked the Commissioners
for the pleasant evening.
Motioiby Councilman Lloyd, seconded by
Councilman Shearer and carried, adjourning meeting at 9:07 P.M.
ATTEST:
CITY CLERK
APPROVED:
MAYOR
O
- 17 -