09-28-1970 - Special 2 Meeting - Minutesm
MINUTES OF THE ADJOURNED REGULAR MEETING OF CITY COUNCIL
CITY OF WEST COVINA, ' CAL-IFO'RNIA
SEPTEMBER 28, 1970.
The adjourned regular meeting of the City Council was called to order
• at 7:00 P.M., in the West Covina Council Chambers by Mayor Ken Chappell.;
ROLL CALL
Present: Mayor Chappell; Councilmen Shearer, Nichols,
Lloyd
Councilman Young (Arrived at 7:15 P.M.)
Others Present: George Aiassa, City Manager
Richard Munse.11, Planning Director
Ross Nammar, Administrative Analyst
Lela Preston, City Clerk
Doug Dawson, Administrative Analyst
H..R. Fast, Public Service Director
George Zimmerman, City Engineer
Ray Remy, Executive Director of SKAG
SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA Mr. Aiassa: We have by .arrangement called
ASSOCIATION OF on Mr. Ray Remy of the.
GOVERNMENTS (SLAG) Southern California Associa-
tion of Governments, better
known as SLAG, for the pur-
pose of advising. Council what .the Association stands for .and what they
hope to accomplish. A certain amount of money has been budgeted for
this but Council has not yet given approval to expend it to them and
tonight, Mr. Remy, will give you a brief resume. of SLAG_
Ray Remy, I .appreciate.v.ery much the opportunity of
Executive Director coming -.out and visiting with.the Council of
Southern California. West Covina. Mr. Aiassa has tried-.to.keep me
Assoc. of Governments away for over a .year and.a half from the new
1111 W. 6th Street -City Hall facility, but finally he fou-nd.
.Los Angeles himself forced to invite .me ou.t.and I.extend
my compliments to .all ofyou for a beautiful
facility, Mr,, Aiassa has indicated, I .have .about a .half hour., so .I
will briefly describe, .the Southern California Association of.
Governments - where we.are, our programs, and what has brought about
the concern for regionalization, and leave the last 15 minutes
basically for your'.questionso
In terms of history., SCAG.was org-anized in.
1966 and basically it was organized out of a reaction to a bill Passed
in the 1963 Legislature by Senator Tom Reese, which set forth that the
State of Californi.a,could establish xegi.onal_planning.districts through-
out the State, if, however you had an Association of Governments
similar to the Bay -Area -Government. Basically out of -the efforts of.
the County ..S.upervi.sors• there was a .strong desire not to .come. _under.....the
particular -divisions. of that .State Juri-sdiction..and to est.abli.sh .an.
organization totally.b-y cities and counties In' the Southern California
area. It was• o,r.iginally composed of five counties and the sixth was
added, which -was -,Imperial. County..
After SCAG was _formed• it -was given .some .
additional re,spon-sibiliti.es-.beyond- the: :advisory .re.spon.sibility of.
meeting and di.scussing. problems regiona-l.:.in scope...: The re.sponsib.i.li-
ties given we•r•e- by-••the-.Dep-artment of Housing, and-..U-rb:an-.De:vel.opment
which put into -their regu-l-at-ions- and, guidelines -that .-..you_, had. to have
some type of ongoing, -planning process---areawide in' order-toF-quali-fy
or apply for -Feder -al- funds_.._ -Thi-s ks-fu-rther~ stre-ngthennEFd--by - the
Bureau of Budget circul1ar -A9-5 which now,- •requ--ire•s some"-one�-hundre-d-
different Federal. -programs w•iil go through -this-. cle.aring.._house....revi.ew
process and -all interested parties are notified of the ,pending... .. .
application funds and the variety of programs offered, not only by
HUD. The idea here is to get some feasible coordination of the
ADJ. C.C. - 9/28/70
SCAG - Cont°do
Page Two
grant process and some general identification on the local level
where the Federal funds are going and to.make sure they are inter-
related and coordinated. I think the concept of regional organiza-
tion was started in 1954 by the Inter -County Regional Association
in Detroit and generally spread in a variety of forms and-wayse.and.
we find now throughout the United States there are some five.
hundred regional type planning or organizations with varying
degrees of authority and ability and re.sponsibilitye (Mentioned
by name many of the various organizations.) They.vary in each.and
every way and area as to how the governments as well as private
industry tries to cope with problems regional in nature.
In looking at the SCAG program we have a
number of particular problems we are involved with. We .try to con-
fine our concerns and interests with the things that cross the
individual boundaries of our respective counties and cities. Our
area covers 38,000 sq. miles and ten and a half million ..people,
which is a frustration in itself because most people will say there
is nothing common about the problems of the City of Camarillo
when you compare it to the City of E1 Centro - they are miles and
miles apart. What is common about the vast inland desert and the
problems of the central city, and Watts - and these are good
legitimate questions. We have a broad area and yet most every part
of the SCAG region is related. The desert is the recreation play-
ground for the metropolitan area; the metropolitan area is the market
place for the commerce of the Imperial. Valley, etc..,etc.
One of our basic programs is the D'evelopment
Guide program, which is an o.ngoing.planning program. It is a
computer -based program in which we .are looking at growth
alternatives for the region. Trying to determine if all of the
zoning patterns and all of the land use designs of the respective
cities and counties were carried out what sort of .population would.
we have in the Southern California area, and can we contain that
type of population? What are the ---projections? If we- make other
types of decisions for- a lower growth -pattern .what is it _going to
do to density, to urban sprawl, -to open space? The -Development Guide
in essence is re -ally' our regional. -planning :program. This .i-_s..the
first effort of a=r-egiona-1 planning..,program and I. wi11.-be ..happy to
leave this booklet with .you,..it .is . a very .f:irs.t. cut.. _o.f_ what we
ought to be doing in regional decision..making :..f.or_..the....ci.ti.es._.and__.
counties, what are. the_..implir-a-t-on.s, f.or._gr..owth.._.o.f....our...re.gio:na- We.
want all of our cities and -counties to take..thi:s.-__-and:._s.tar.t.-:.debating
and developing it and being concerned ,about the- imp.l,i.ca-t.i.ons.-
throughout the region - both management decisions and..pol.icy
decisions. It is a policy plan rather than the- things we--pu.t.-..on
a wall and show individual parcels as open space, --etc.
In addition/the Federal Government has placed a
few requirements on us. HUD requires be -fore any city or county
-
in our area can have any open space grants after October .1, that
there must be a certified ,plann-ing. process for .ope.n .space ...My...
staff has been working with cities and counties tryi_ng,.to.ident:ify
areas that have regional open space elements - 50...acres...or...more.
We distributed this book and discussed it for the first time last
Thursday at our general assembly. The idea is that this too will
lead to better decisions and better understanding of our.ope-n-..
spacings.
.Also we have the requirement of a Water and .fir
Plan, the same type of program required or -,.no City or -County would be
eligible for Federal funds in the_ ar-ea of Water and...Sewero We have
approved through our Executive Committee and now distributed and
asking for dialogue over the next year or so material on the water
and sewer program. It is really an inventory of what exists in the
area of water and sewer lines.
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ADJ. C.C. - 9/28/70
SCAG - Contad.
Page Three
We have an ongoing Transportation Program...
We have a merger of what is called TASK and that has.now been
merged into the Southern California Association -of Governments..
We have also been the recipient from_the Department -of T.ransporta-
• tion, a grant from them to study the Santa Ana corridor and the.
Freeway corridor. Also we are doing a Master Plan of transporta-
tion for the : Rapid Transit System for Southern California..
Upon the completion and acceptance of that particular program then
all agencies applying for capital grants in mass transit will be
eligible for two-thirds rather than fifty-fifty as presently exists.
Citizen Participation - this is a problem the
Federal Government is stressing more and more, but beyond .that the
general feeling is that citizens should become more involved in
what is happening in their region. We have .several .programs, one
with the Regional Planning Association in Citizen Participation
and another with UCLA in Minorities in Planning, which weinsist in
providing funds to the University to bring in graduate students from
minority background to'become involved in public administration in
planning. We are also the Regional Association for Region 10 in
Criminal Justice planning, in which .all of the criminal justice
planning funds do flow through us down to the subregions.
Environmental Quality - we are embarking now in a
major study of looking at solid waste sites of what are the long
range problems as well as potentials in the disposal of solid waste
from our six county area. We also have as a third party contract a
minority study and I brought some material on this, and this..is
basically a grant given to the State of California to look into the
long term deficiencies in public agency employment. What should
the academic institutions be doing now to prepare for the critical
needs in the employment in public agencies. We are assisting the
State of California in gathering information about this and
correlating into a study.
Stucfes are all well and good, but a study is
only as good as somebody that can pick it up and do something with
it. If you have a study and somebody expended funds on it then
someone has to be able to take the recommendation and ought to -be
able to make some decisions and improve and make things better. This
gets to the heart of the basic question of SLAG. Should a regional
agency have power? If so, what type? And where should such an
agency go? These questions are difficult, they border on home rule,
on the infringements of rights of the individual city. And if we do
give up power to an individual agency, what agency and what
checks should be there for the cities'. I have worked withand for cities
for 8 years in the League of California Cities, so I understand this
problem. The Board of Directors of the California Supervisors
Association and the League of California Cities met ,jointlyDfor the
first time in 20 years, several months ago and they developed a.
strong policy statement dealing with regional agencies. That.if the
city should so want it and the County so want it, then a regional
agency should be able to do something and make some decisions.
The reason I even venture into this rather stormy and difficult area
is because this is the basic question of a regional agency. I.£
we are there to be nothing more than a regional study agency then
that is all we will be and we will be shortly and quickly replaced.
I cite the example in San Francisco, there -were fourteen regional -
agencies in San Francisco Bay area at my last count; out of the
fourteen, twelve have regulatory and taxing or independent fund-
raising power, two don't. Of those two the Cities and Counties
control one - ABAG. It is powerless, can't do anything, it is a
forum for discussion. It seems to me the majo.r.question.facing
cities and counties is the other twelve. What implementation, what
involvement, what direction, what control, what abilities should
there be for cities and counties in regional decision making? What
is the best vehicle?
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ADJ. C.C. - 9/28/70
SCAG - Cont ° d.
Page Four
I guess the major pitch I would make for SCAG,
and the same one I would make to any City Council, is that
regional decisions have been made, will be made and continue to be
made. The real crucial issues are as to how much involvement and.
• what piece of the action do cities and counties have? And if we do
fashion an institution, I would urge every city and county to be
strongly involved in fashioning that institution and see that it
represents the needs of the individual community and also
represents the.needs of y.o.ur region. The bills in Sacramento are
clear. There were five coastline bills; one, the strongest would
have turned over to a State Coastline Agency the .land use control.
of all coastline from the highest point of the tidelind to the
highest point of the San Gabriel Valley or the nearest coastline
mountains. And if I read that correctly, if I were standing in
Long Beach I would be looking at the San Gabriel mountains, and there
would be 77 cities who wouldn°t have land use. I think this is the
type of legislation, while it didn't move very far, it is the type
that you see much of. Whether it be transportation, open space or
solid waste or air pollution - any number of fields, these are the
types of bills being introduced in Sacramento. So I urge, not
necessarily from the standpoint of SCAG, but from the standpoint of
cities and counties, that you move aggressively in those areas you
think you should and give all the support you can to the organizations
you settle upon, regardless of what that is and to give all the
support you can in your case to the League of California Cities,
because the legislators are concerned only with one thing and that is
the solution of problems and the citizens that lobby those legislators
are in the same way. Even the private sector - you look at the report
of the Council on .Economic Development which is the regional chamber
organization, they call for a complete restructuring in government.
The two tier form, a small neighborhood and large metropolitan areas.
The State Legislature calls for strong regional involvement.
In the San Francisco Bay area it is the private sector who is calling.
for directly -elected regional government.
I think the important thing is for cities .and
counties to take a strong look at what is being asked for and to
fashion the best organization to meet what is being asked for and to
have the strongest piece of the action you can get. With that I will
be happy to close and try and answer any questions I can on the
SCAG program.
Councilman Lloyd: You have already articulated some of the feelings
I have about the regional form of government,
such as SCAG, and I.am.not really sure that you
haven't answered all the questions I had. I feel slightly intimidated,
as a Councilman by an agency which I strongly supported in 1966 when
the question was -- should we be involved in such? And, I personally,
went forward and said - yes, we should be involved. One of the
questions asked me at that time was what is to prevent it from taking
you over? And, I pointed out the reason it wouldn't take us over was
because we were autonomous and that each city could run its e�i-fand.
we were provided for by the Constitution of the State, etc.,etc.,.and
as a result it just simply couldn't occur; but demonstrating my....
naivete I didn't look -at the power to control by the very fact that....
our organization or your organization now has the right of decision
as to which City will and which City will not have certain advantages
which would accrue from Federal programs - that is correct, isn't it?
Mr. Remy: Only in the broadest term at this point. We
have no priority setting responsibility nor .do we
have the ability to say 11yes." or "no" to a _g.r--ant.
We can only comment on the grant, but I think..in the farthe.st
extension of what you say, for example taking the 6-county water -.....pro-
gram, if West Covina was not on that and then came in we could very
easily comment negatively, and I think .probably we should comment
negatively if you were not in on the ongoing process and I think it
would have effect on your getting a grant.
N
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ADJ. C.C. - 9/28/70 Page Five
SCAG - Cont°d.
Councilman Lloyd: In the legislative process then, of course, what the
thinking people were asking me about - it is.coming
to pass. It doesn't question you individually, nor
your staff, nor any of those of the other cities who are associated
• with you, but it brings it down to the point that the only defense we
have at this point is to fall quickly into line or we will fall out
all the way. That is the element that is not only distasteful to me
but almost an element of defranchisement of the legislative .process
as envisioned. I am the one who is willing to form a larger.City
with the formation of a government between the Cities of Covina and
West Covina, and this body did at least agree to investigate it, but
I am sad to say no one else was willing, and this of course again is
the extension of what you are talking about. You stated the very
element which to my way of thinking will require that these cities
do form, but in the formation of these cities should it .be .at this
level, which I think. --.communicates with the voter directly in.a day-
by-day situation,.or are we going to be faced with a larger.govern-
mental agency, such as SCAG or some other. We are even vaguely dis-
cussing the possibility of splitting the State because of its
immensity and its.population. The point I.make- to you as a pro-
fessional public administrator and a highly qualified one - but not
withstanding that I am also fearful in representing the people of the
City of West Covina that you might not be the instrumentation no
matter how well meaning you are. I have no guarantee that you will
be head of this organization and the man that replaces.yau may be
very bad for "my City". I am really taking you into the future and
what is our' -position and what protects us as a City.
Mr. Remy: You have raised a number of difficult questions,
and som6-have =bean discussed at length by
Jack Merlman of the Supervisors Association and
Bud Carpenter of the League, as to really where are we headed in
this world of regional activity. How do we go before the legislature?
How do they go before the legislature and answer the statement we
don"t have enough open space? We are not solving our solid waste
problems; we haven't done enough on the shoreline objection, we
still have air pollution. Any number of groups come before the
legislature to plead the case of an individual approach to the
individual problem and they all say that fragmented jurisdictions
can't solve it. I am not totally convinced that fragmented
jurisdictions haven't done a pretty good job in solving a lot of
things and I would have had a difficult time working for*the League
as long as I did if I didn't feel that way. I also get a little
concerned when we see single pur.po.se..approaches.to the single
purpose problems without any ability to relate those problems
together. I also become concerned when you see entirely different
government bodies over each of those problems whether they be water
districts or pollution agencies or what, and I..gue.ss myplea is that
whatever approach does come to pass, and as I say SCAG may..no.t be. it,
that the only protection is that cities and counties run it.. If .
there are five, •- or'-terr, or just one, at least that it is run .and
controlled by local government because that is what is-
.happening..
in the northern part of the State and it really isn't what .is happen-
ing anywhere else around the Country. I don't know how I can-.al.l.ay
your particular fears because they get to the point of saying what
happens if we create something that suddenly turns on the very people
that created it.
Councilman Lloyd: That is correct.
Mr. Remy: And makes decisions not in the best interests
and I think there is no assurance that.it wont,
except that cities and counties.ar.e..run-.by
elected people and to the extent that cities and counties make
decisions that are inappropriate they can be removed by the same
vehicle. What worries me is the alternatives!
(Councilman Lloyd introduced Mr. Remy to a group of students from
Willowood School, who are studying government at its basic level,
ADJ. C.C. 9-28-70 Page Six
SCAG - Cont°d.
their teacher and also principal - Mr. Buzz.Bemoll.)
Councilman Lloyd: However, in discussion on this, you and I, and
the rest of the Council body cannot come to a
• conclusion except that what you are recommending
and of course/ the course we must take within the realm of reason,
time and space, is that we must involve; ourselves in this element of
super -government, but I am fearful. When you say - take yourself a
piece of the action, the question really becomes very pragmatic and
Machiavellian when we say how do I get a piece of the action,very
quickly.
Mr. Remy: You get a piece of the action when I look at the
Executive Committee and the decisions SCAG
makes - there is no other court than the court
of the cities and counties. There is nobody else we are dealing
with, or to, or through, than the local city officials. And there
are many attempts to try and change that structure, to put citizen
groups or interest groups as such in interest -making decisions.
Our Committee structure as well as our policy body is nothing more
or less than local elected officials and I think you get a piece of
the action, although I know it is extremely difficult, because I
know there is very few hours left in the day of an elected
official. This is one of the other legislators favorite harps -
that as you look for local involvement the local officials are not
paid and they don't have the time and they have a thousand
commitments and therefore we can't really consider that, and I don't
have an answer to that. I just think there is something very
important about local decision making and the access of the citizens
to his elected official, and I think when we lose that we have lost
a lot.
Councilman Shearer: I have one question and this is probably what
prompted some of this discussion. Why -did
our assessment go up three times?
Mr. Remy: The basic reason for the increase in dues is that
most of the expenses of SCAG - in fact almost all
of it were being carried by the Federal govern-
ment and most particularly by HUD. I think this creates a fairly
intolerable situation from a local standpoint and from our..standpoint.
What we are in -effect doing is picking up a significant portion of
the administrative costs of the organization and by being able to do
that we at least purchase that modicum of freedom from Federal control
and we are at least in a position now - as we have done on .three
occasions in the past 4 months - of writing HUD and telling them we
will not accept that guideline, and if it comes down to it, where
they take their federal grants away, we can still operate.
Councilman Shearer: So your organization didn't triple in the last
year?
Mr. Remy: Oh no.
Councilman Shearer: What percentage of cities are members of
SCAG for this coming year?
Mr. Remy: We have yet to lose a member that was a
member last year. We haven't received all
the dues statements and we are keeping a.
close tab and I haven't had anyone call saying they are withdrawing
because of the dues increase. Out of 147 cities there are 107 who
are members and out of the cities over 100,000 there are two who are
not - Anaheim and Glendale. The rest of those -over 100,000 are
members. All six counties are members.
Councilman Shearer: How are the dues calculated?
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ADJ. C.C. 9/28/70 Page Seven
SCAG - Cont°d.
Mr. Remy: The dues are calculated on the basis of an
adopted budget approved by the General Assembly
and this is the general fund budget. That is
then divided in half and the counties pay half and the individual
cities pay the other half of the total budget. There is a base fee
charge of $100. per City; and $2500. per County. What remains in
the City fund and the County fund is picked up on a population ratio.
Mayor Chappell: Are there any other questions? Mr. Aiassa, do
you have any questions?
Mr. Aiassa: Yes with regard to bonding - I believe SCAG
does have a bonding of the Executive Directors
so we don't have the same thing happen that
happened at Berkeley?
Mr. Remy: In answer to the question and the concern
referring to the Bay Area problem, there was a
major misappropriation of funds and because of
that there was a bill passed that is law, we don't even handle our
own funds, they go to L.A. County and we withdraw funds as needed.
We are also audited by our own auditors and also audited by several
Federal agencies as well as the County auditors.
Mayor Chappell: We certainly thank you for coming down. I feel
you have answered most of the questions we had
in the back of our mind.
Councilman Young: Mr. Mayor - if I may I would like to apologize
to the speaker and the Council for being
absent for most of this presentation. I am very
sorry about it. I have no legitimate excuse and that is the problem.
I will have to read'the minutes.
Mayor Chappell: We thank you for taking time out of your busy
schedule, Mr. Remy, and coming down and giving
us the information we need. It will be on the
agenda for the next meeting and then we will come back with a
decision.
ADJOURNMENT Motion by Councilman Shearer, seconded by
Councilman Lloyd, and carried, adjourning this
meeting at 7:35 P.M.
APPROVED:
MAYOR
ATTEST:
CITY CLERK
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